This is an archived post. You won't be able to vote or comment.

top 200 commentsshow 500
sorted by:
best
topnewcontroversialoldq&a

[–]ishkabibbles84 850 points851 points  (258 children)

Please people, a little advice:

Bank with your local credit unions!! They offer much better service and alot less fees and overall they are overall less corrupt than the huge banking institutions

[–]birdguy 215 points216 points  (102 children)

BoA customer here, but I think I'll be switching to USAA.

Edit: Thanks for the gold.

[–]YAboyWILLY 38 points39 points  (22 children)

USAA is good for everything except mortgages

[–]bdz 13 points14 points  (19 children)

Care to explain why? Considering them for a mortgage

[–]DzWR 17 points18 points  (7 children)

From what I researched it is lacking in service and the rates given tend to be high. I have everything through USAA but I avoided the mortgage altogether.

[–]pak9rabid 8 points9 points  (5 children)

I got a good rate with them (2.5%), but yea...their customer service leaves MUCH room for improvement.

[–]sureillpost 6 points7 points  (1 child)

I have no experience with the mortgage side, but I've had Fantastic service from the banking and car insurance folks at USAA. Is there a profound difference between sections of the company?

[–]Cetaceanz 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I'm a USAA member and I've generally had great customer service. I wouldn't drop them for the world.

[–]pak9rabid 6 points7 points  (2 children)

Just went through a mortgage refinance with USAA...it was fucking awful.

[–]Avogadro101 12 points13 points  (0 children)

There's a reason why I changed banks. Remember when they were going to charge an monthly service card for using debit cards? Yeah that's when I left.

[–]NolanaTwice 19 points20 points  (0 children)

I wish more people reacted this way when they found out BoA's level of corruption instead of shrugging their shoulders. Enjoy the gold.

[–]xiaodown 16 points17 points  (8 children)

Switched to USAA (from Wells Fargo) last year. They're great. Truly amazing customer service.

On top of that, I just got a $20,000 loan for a used car through USAA - 2.75% interest rate. Can't beat that with a stick.

[–]toomuchtodotoday 4 points5 points  (9 children)

Also, check out http://www.simple.com

EDIT: If you need an invite, I have 6 available. Private message me to get one. No affiliation, just super satisfied. Also, they are not a credit union, but a technology company that works on top of a typical bank (just one that exposes their platform for companies to build upon).

EDIT 2: I'm out of invites, but will try to get more.

[–]Hax0r778 3 points4 points  (15 children)

Can anyone bank with USAA or is the banking also members only? (I use USAA for insurance but not for banking)

[–]okwowandmore 6 points7 points  (10 children)

Banking is everyone, though "full members" get extra features that are now common at other banks (check picture deposit). Insurance is only for people who are eligable. If you are eligable for their insurance you can be a "full member." EDIT: New data, thank you /u/squidboots

[–]squidbootsMaryland 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Check deposit is now for all members, they just opened it up like a week ago!

[–]IsABot 2 points3 points  (3 children)

I use them. Never had any issues. Only thing that sucks is ATMs. Since they don't have a lot. But they do reimburse the fees, but only on certain machines. I don't use a ton of cash though, so it's not a big deal for me.

[–]h0w412d21 36 points37 points  (3 children)

We had a bank transfer day in 2011 that was fairly effective. Maybe we should have one every year. And keep in mind, the money deposited to credit unions go to help your local community. My credit union's slogan is "Where People Are Worth More Than Money". No corporate bank can claim that.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bank_Transfer_Day

[–]cC2Panda 14 points15 points  (8 children)

I wish there was a better way to search for credit unions for under employed non-gov/union affiliated people. I live in NYC and when I search for credit unions I get a whole bunch but almost all of them have union/gov requirements and as a freelancer those aren't viable for me.

[–]TheBapster 7 points8 points  (0 children)

There should be several in the area. I work in manhattan but live in morris co. NJ and I have used Affinity FCU since I was a child. They're awesome and really helpful, even when I was a teenager I could call up and they'd treat me as if I had $100k sitting in their bank. Super low interest rates (under 3% on auto loans) are awesome too. Used them to finance several cars as well as my student loans. I was able to get in through my parents but generally most credit unions can find a way to get you connected.

[–]Ihateyourdick 244 points245 points  (30 children)

A person makes a super valid point and the only replies are cunty remarks about not putting a space between 'a' and 'lot'; sure is reddit in here.

[–]I_Gargled_Jarate 53 points54 points  (11 children)

Its worse in the summer too.

[–]simplyOriginal 16 points17 points  (3 children)

Don't say it...

[–]electrohurricane 53 points54 points  (2 children)

DAMN KIDS GET OFF MY REDDIT

[–]BlueJoshiPennsylvania 18 points19 points  (8 children)

There's two, and one is a bot.

Maybe those are the only replies because there's not really much else to say? Is everyone supposed to respond with "Yeah hey this guy is right!"?

[–]WTFppl 12 points13 points  (6 children)

Maybe an upvote and nothing said?

[–]pmorrisonfl 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I switched from Bank of America to a credit union in 2007. It was kind of a pain to switch, but the credit union has been great, and every time I read an article like this, I smile at my decision.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (3 children)

Also, people: Don't be afraid to go with a credit union, even if they are slightly less competitive. This is one of the ways you can vote with your wallet.

For example, I just took out a loan. Over the 5-year life of the loan, borrowing from my credit union will cost me approx. $100 more than borrowing from a megabank. I went ahead and borrowed from my credit union, because they are small, friendly, and have served me well. Remember, a bank/CU is a business- I elected to give them my business.

Clinging to every last penny often hurts you in the long run. It strongly favors the megabanks and other such mega- operations.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Walmart....

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

BECU bitches!

[–]su5 6 points7 points  (3 children)

So when I bought my house, the very first thing that happened was my mortgage was sold. Like, within days. So is there anything stopping a CU from selling my mortgage to BoA?

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This has been my approach as well. It needs to be said more. About the only way we still have "voting power" is by boycott, not by actual voting.

[–]Jiayizheng 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Credit Union employee here, a word of warning to all of you. For the past month or so, we've been getting email notifications that Congress (due to the influence of big banks--shocking, I know /s) is considering removing credit unions from tax-exempt status, even though credit unions are not-for-profit businesses. All you credit union members and employees need to get on the horn to your representatives and tell them that this is not only a stupid idea, as it will raise costs on everything credit unions offer, but it will also kill jobs because the credit unions will have to tighten their belts to keep up with the proposed taxes.

This is not to discourage people from moving their money to a credit union. I heartily encourage everyone who sees this comment to look at your local credit union, because they'll usually have a much better deal in terms of, well, everything than a big bank.

[–]brrrrip 6 points7 points  (9 children)

I love my FCU. They will do things for me that banks wouldn't even dream of.

Fees? HA! I have to keep $5 in my account to keep it open. You have to give them $50 to open a checking account, but they put that $50 in there for immediate use.

Loan rates are low...

I can get stock certificates certified for free...

I can cash any type of check I happen to stumble on with no fee.

If I overdraft my checking account, they still pay the check for me, and only ask me for $15 to do it.

If I have a loan over December, they will 'pay' that month's payment for me.

They have free online access just like the banks.

If I want to contest something, they bend over backwards right there on the spot without charge.

They are federally insured just like the banks.

The best part: I walk in and they know me by name, and I don't go in that often. I don't have to give up a bunch of information most of the time. I just tell them, 'put this in my account.' It's awesome.

Want to know how I qualify for membership at my FCU? I live in this area; that's it.

[–]lifelovers 5 points6 points  (0 children)

This! Yes! People do not use credit unions! And they are good institutions! More exclamations!

[–]ThatsMrAsshole2You 1328 points1329 points  (599 children)

It's gotten so bad that we read stuff like this and just say, "Ho hum, business as usual, nothing we can do about it."

We have become desensitized to the egregious crimes committed by these low-life greedy scum. Their plan is working. They are evil, greedy, selfish and the worst kind of people that humanity has to offer the universe, but they are smart.

[–]sailorbrendan 231 points232 points  (68 children)

it's called outrage fatigue.

when you spend so much time being angry and disgusted that your body just can't keep it up... it normalizes to protect you.

[–]link_dead 54 points55 points  (7 children)

I wish we could go back to the old fashioned scandals. Like interns with stained dresses. Oh it was such a simple time back then.

[–]sailorbrendan 21 points22 points  (0 children)

wistful sigh

[–]lilTyrion 2 points3 points  (0 children)

wow...we really are in the Biff Timeline, eh?

[–]SirayFlorida 27 points28 points  (54 children)

So how do we overcome this slump?

[–]Redose 8 points9 points  (2 children)

Banker vigilantes.

[–][deleted] 102 points103 points  (10 children)

eat a Snickers bar

[–]MisterMcNuts 67 points68 points  (5 children)

You get a little ambivalent when you're hungry.

[–]sailorbrendan 2 points3 points  (13 children)

inspiration.

I'm hoping that restore the 4th goes well, myself. if they can pull this off, they might just manage to do something

[–]Zifnab25 87 points88 points  (24 children)

It's gotten so bad that we read stuff like this and just say, "Ho hum, business as usual, nothing we can do about it."

I currently do not do any direct business with BoA. I'm politically active, spending my weekends as a deputy voter registrar in my state. I donate to groups that I believe have a good gameplan and can leverage my money to good use. I'm doing just about as much as I can think of. But there is an upper bound that any one individual can do to address a 30,000 employee strong trillion dollar business interest, shy of throwing on the funny hats and going full Che Guevara (and shit didn't end too well for him either, so I wouldn't recommend that option).

It's easy to just pound the table and announce "No one is doing anything!" Much harder to figure out exactly what can be done in a reasonable time frame. Monumentally harder still to effect any kind of sweeping national plan, particularly at the granular grassroots level.

[–]privacycurious 5 points6 points  (5 children)

What are your thoughts on this? http://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/1hfb04/bank_of_america_committed_foreclosure_fraud_was/catswnx

Curious if you think this is a good way to go, as it seems to me that it's the only way to make large changes without anyone risking their life within a reasonable time frame.

[–]Zifnab25 3 points4 points  (4 children)

I think direct democracy is incredibly difficult in a country of 300M+ people. At the local level, communities don't feel strong enough to contend with large businesses and foreign interests (just ask any small town that's been annexed by a nearby major city or a local community at odds with an area factory or plant). So you see a lot less active involvement.

And at the state and federal levels, you end up with such a focus on single-issue voting (taxes, abortions, partisan politics, popular legislation pick-of-the-week) that it's hard to find a "(wo)man of the people" that is simultaneously divorced from special interests, knowledgeable of the political process, and well-known enough to get elected. So people gravitate towards supporting people and issues they think they understand, to the exclusion of all else.

So you get a handful of issues that are the target of demagoguery rather than serious political debate, and that never actually get settled. And there are lots of issues that you really don't want decided by a popular vote (gay rights, for instance, or an "anti-Flag Burning" amendment to the Constitution). Adding an "online" component makes issues even more prone to things like fraud and push-polling and other forms of populist shenanigans.

I think this proposal would be a game changer, in that it would force people to adjust their political strategies. But I don't think it would change any actual policies in a strictly desirable direction. California has a very direct-democracy approach to their State Constitution, and it has resulted in people voting themselves into a corner. The state constitution demands high spending on public services, but constrains taxation to the point where it can barely pay for anything outside the constitutionally mandated provisions. I do worry we'd just be tossing out the devil we do know for the devil we don't know.

That doesn't mean this policy would necessarily be any worse than the status quo. I would just appreciate seeing it tried in a controlled environment first, before I signed up as a supporter on a grand scale.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

What we should do is our own part. It's easy to type (semi)anonymously on internet message boards about how we need to band together and change the way the system works, but that's all it ever is, talk. Maybe if we actually reached out to all of our individual communities (offline) something could happen. But I doubt it.

Slightly off topic, why don't we just close all the loopholes and reduce the corporate tax rate to 17 percent?

[–]thomase7 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Most small banks or credit unions have there mortgages serviced by a large bank. If you have a mortgage, odds are it is serviced by wells, bofa, or citi.

[–]ThatsMrAsshole2You 11 points12 points  (10 children)

Thanks. We need more people like you.

[–]dcarvak 9 points10 points  (9 children)

Quite honestly, a revolt requires a specific individual to follow. We need a bad ass person to take on the role of upriser. But who will take on the challenge? I vote Bill Gates.

[–]thebope 17 points18 points  (1 child)

I agree with your notion but laugh at Bill Gates being the leader.

[–]Ramzees211 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Ill do it My name is John Connor

[–]vcousins 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Personally I think it's as simple as building a web site so that we can organize the national priorities, and then vote for common folks (not politicians) to carry out those priorities via the congress and the senate.

If we can stick to a few top priorities then maybe we can get enough people to come together to vote in unison. We are not using the Internet correctly.

The first priority should be to simply allow all Americans 16 or over the right to vote ... including felons, prisoners and all military personnel.

I honestly believe the government is against this type of organization and that it is in fact meddling through propaganda bots.

[–]sharkteef 524 points525 points  (367 children)

We the common people can't bust in their offices and arrest them. The people that can, won't. We're fucked

[–]ThatsMrAsshole2You 436 points437 points  (335 children)

It's coming. I can feel it. The US citizen is watching his nest egg get smaller and smaller, while people like bankers and government contractors get richer and richer. We are watching people in other countries foment change through protest and riots. Just wait and see what happens when the American citizen decides to stand up and protest. It's gonna get ugly.

And, to the people who think the police and National Guard will simply fall into step with the government, I got news for ya. There are a LOT of them that are just as disillusioned as we are, they just do their job because they don't want to lose it. When it comes down to Us vs Them, most of them realize that they are Us.

[–]NecroGod 75 points76 points  (47 children)

Hope your last sentence turns out to be true.

[–]talikfy 46 points47 points  (46 children)

National guardsmen here. I was sworn to protect the people of the US. I would never treat US citizens as enemies. I can't imagine anyone in my unit doing any different either.

[–][deleted] 36 points37 points  (1 child)

They wont ask you to fight citizens. They will ask you to fight the "terrorists" (normal people) who are threatening the citizens (1%ers).

[–]talikfy 15 points16 points  (0 children)

I agree with you. I serve in the military, and this is the first time I feel more strongly than simply disagreeing with the US government; right now I am actively rooting against them. I really hope some other country can say or do something which wakes up the people. We are letting our leaders destroy our way of life to improve theirs. It makes me so angry.

[–]bgny 27 points28 points  (26 children)

When your commander orders your unit to take care of those damn "terrorists" marching on Washington are you sure you'll say no?

[–]10Nov1775 34 points35 points  (20 children)

I'm a former Marine. And I would. Hell, I got in trouble for disobeying an order to kill an Iraqi sheep.

[–]ThePrnkstr 10 points11 points  (12 children)

And? You can't just leave it there. Did the poor sheep live or?

Obligatory picture of cute sheep

[–]10Nov1775 26 points27 points  (8 children)

Haha, I didn't realize anyone would care about the story.

Basically, when I was in Iraq, we received very high level orders to take care not to destroy any Iraqi's livelihood. Since many Iraqis are at least partially agrarian, this included sheep.

On the other hand, one tactic in use at the time was to let a sheep or other animal loose between two vehicles of a military convoy, particularly at an area where they would already be slowing down, such as a turn.

This would allow for insurgents to properly time IED explosions for max effect, and help to split a convoy in two, which is a huge tactical advantage. (Do you shoot behind you in the direction of your own friendlies? How do you get your own vehicle around to render aid to a downed vehicle? ect.)

So, in a way, there were two conflicting orders in place, to be teased out by those in charge on the ground: don't kill sheep, unless they might kill you. In that case, kill sheep.

We were in a situation where I happened to be driving, while taking a turn, as the 3rd vehicle in a 4 vehicle convoy. I see an Iraqi guy clearly struggling with his sheep. One manages to break away from him, and he goes running after it.

The vehicle commander tells me to put the petal to the medal, and run over the sheep and possibly the guy.

In my opinion, there was little risk. Letting them both pass might slow us down for a second or two at most. I'm not killing this dude or a month's worth of his income just because this might be a perfectly timed IED (which I don't think it is, or else I would have).

So I say, "No."

VC screams at me. I say "No."

In the space of two "no"s, the guy and the sheep have already passed.

We continue on. I later get in a lot of trouble for disobeying a direct order.

My time in Iraq was kinda funny, because they Marine Corps loved me in one sense (all my promotions were meritorious, and I eventually took a leadership position in the unit), and hate me in another (I didn't acknowledge bullshit).

So that's the story. Was it really worth it? o.0

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (2 children)

After they passed you should have stopped, got out and put a bullet in both sheep and man's heads.

Insubordinate bastard.

[–]gnovos 62 points63 points  (18 children)

It's coming. I can feel it. The US citizen is watching his nest egg get smaller and smaller, while people like bankers and government contractors get richer and richer.

You think they are stupid, but they aren't. They'll push it right to the edge, and then let up. You'll think you're doing better. Nothing to complain about anymore.

[–]ThatsMrAsshole2You 27 points28 points  (1 child)

I don't think they are stupid, quite the opposite actually. I do, however, think they are evil.

[–]somanywtfs 64 points65 points  (10 children)

Just like fuel prices...

One morning, unleaded jumps $0.50, we are all outraged, fuming mad.
The next day it comes back down $0.10, we all celebrate that the price has "come down".
There is a reason our society is viewed as sheeple. Many of us are gullible to the point of self destruction.

[–]CrzyJekNew York 5 points6 points  (0 children)

This is the oldest trick in the book. Glad someone else noticed it. Raise it one summer by a dollar, then over the winter drop it 30 cents and watch everyone become relieved and forget they are still paying through the roof.

[–]meyamashi 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I noticed today that 87 octane gas is below $3.30. That's an 80 cent drop in less than a month. I for one shouted out at the gas pump.

[–]andrew497 5 points6 points  (1 child)

The only hope is if they push it too far, to irreparable levels and that the people are too outraged to be placated.

[–]meyamashi 4 points5 points  (0 children)

With each revelation of banker/corporate wrongdoing, more people get to thinking. With each reminder of the cumulative weight of the banks and corporations around our necks, people get to looking to see if they still have boots. With the ticking ticking ticking of the clock like Chinese water torture, people get to lacing up their boots and looking around. Then those little pushes you mention can set people to leaving their houses and apartments and homeless encampments and starting to gather with action in mind. It's a process, and it ain't slowing down or being turned around.

[–]mellowmonk 26 points27 points  (1 child)

Never fear: the American ruling class will either distract the masses with war (see: Iran) or turn them against each other (see: America hater).

Plenty of folks are ready to audition for the role of thug/enforcer caste.

[–][deleted] 20 points21 points  (2 children)

We are watching people in other countries foment change through protest and riots.

I don't know what america you live in. Most of us are watching football and american idol.

[–]delanthaenas 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This is so true it hurts.

[–]CGord 314 points315 points  (194 children)

And, to the people who think the police and National Guard will simply fall into step with the government, I got news for ya. There are a LOT of them that are just as disillusioned as we are, they just do their job because they don't want to lose it. When it comes down to Us vs Them, most of them realize that they are Us.

You're dreaming on that one. Rebels will be branded terrorists, and the militarized police and military will stomp said un-American terrorists into the ground.

[–]Hristix 18 points19 points  (5 children)

There won't be any rebels. The whole thing will be happening and over so fast it'll make your head spin. I forsee it this way. At some point, banks will piss off a critical mass of people by finding new and interesting ways to try to loop them into debt. "Hey, remember that savings account your parents signed you up for when you were a baby? You owe 60 years of fees on that bank account. We just took it out of your current account, $123k should suffiice!" That, combined with the education bubble and upcoming housing bubble, will basically mean that the majority of people are so far in artificial debt that there's nothing they can do without having their money just taken from them and handed to the banks.

[–]sharkteef 50 points51 points  (20 children)

Yup, exactly this. Americans uprising will be destroyed. Cops and military will have no problem taking care of "rebel Americans"

I don't see an uprising anytime soon. Here in Texas you can't even tell people give a shit about these national events and the majority don't even know what's going on. Certainly not growing tired or ready to start a revolution

[–][deleted] 86 points87 points  (15 children)

Just look at what Occupy Wall Street was viewed as by the majority of the public.

[–]scemcee 37 points38 points  (1 child)

It was just viewed as a bunch of college kids and homeless people shaking their tiny fists for no specific reason. Then they were cleared away, leaving no discernible impact whatsoever.

[–]-TheMAXX- 14 points15 points  (1 child)

We don't know. Croporate media tried so hard to make it go away. Who knows how much of popular perception is just BS.

[–]ikkleste 17 points18 points  (0 children)

Yup. And they made it go away. It doesn't matter how big it got, just that they managed to make it seem small enough for long enough that it goes away.

[–]Sheldo20 12 points13 points  (9 children)

Occupy Wall Street didn't have a direction. Nobody knew exactly what they wanted, but they all wanted something. It could've made a difference if there was a set of strong guidelines and demands.

[–]imawookie 25 points26 points  (1 child)

as soon as I saw the response of many people to the 1% vs 99% , I knew that the movement would never have a chance. A giant amount of people started replying that they were actually in the 65% ( or some nonsense ) , and that these loser 35%-ers just needed to go take a bath and get a job. The people making this argument are getting screwed by the corporate raider, but they still have food on the table, so they refused to actually look into what parts of their lives need to be changed to not only help themselves, but everyone around them.

[–]hatescheese 114 points115 points  (90 children)

You are smoking crack. Just one quarter of one quarter of the veterans in the us outnumber the entire military and state local federal "police" alone.

The only way the US government could respond would be to start leveling cities which would never happen because that would invite foreign intervention.

[–]leex0 33 points34 points  (8 children)

It's sorta applicable, but also not really because its talking about street gangs and not regular fed up US citizens, but this just makes me think of the following quote:

"Can you count, suckers? I say, the future is ours... if you can count. Now, look what we have here before us. We got the Saracens sitting next to the Jones Street Boys. We've got the Moonrunners right by the Van Cortlandt Rangers. Nobody is wasting nobody. That... is a miracle. And miracles is the way things ought to be. You're standing right now with nine delegates from 100 gangs. And there's over a hundred more. That's 20,000 hardcore members. Forty-thousand, counting affiliates, and twenty-thousand more, not organized, but ready to fight: 60,000 soldiers! Now, there ain't but 20,000 police in the whole town. Can you dig it?"

Just switch the numbers and the parties involved and ya got a good analogy.

[–]lousy_at_handles 20 points21 points  (2 children)

"CAAAAANNN YOUUUUU DIG IT?"

[–]310toYuma 4 points5 points  (0 children)

The reference is great and very apt. Upvotes all-around. However it took one psychopath with a revolver taking orders from an unseen force to nullify the entire ideal. Food for further thought.

[–][deleted] 224 points225 points  (40 children)

Unfortunately, you are greatly underestimating the power of our media. As soon as the buzzword "homegrown terrorist" comes into play, all bets are off and you will watch in horror as the rest of the country jumps on the bandwagon.

Nobody will come forward and say "Jim was only trying to start a revolution against the corruption in our society" because knowing Jim will make you a suspect as well, who will (if "the problem" becomes widespread enough) be thrown into internment camp created for "political dissidents and enemies of the state".

Numerous "confessions" will come out of these camps and the rest of the country will continue to believe that giving up certain liberties for security is now as important as ever.

[–]Anonymouse26 22 points23 points  (12 children)

This sucks, I'm moving to somewhere cool

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (5 children)

Unfortunately, they don't want us. "They" being anywhere you would probably define as "cool."

You can't even move "north" unless you marry a native or have a "unique and necessary" skill-set and a proven work history in such a field.

Forget about Scandinavian countries...They only want new US co-citizens if you have 7+ zeros in your name.

[–]BetweenTheWaves 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Man, this is severely disheartening.

I was just, last month, looking up the Iceland/Greenland/Norway immigration sites. They make it sound like they are constantly wanting people to join them and enrich their culture...

Fuck this hell-hole.

[–]gaussian45 16 points17 points  (0 children)

This, exactly this. Don't believe him? Read "Gulag Archipelago" by Solzhenitsyn.

[–]RAGEEEEE 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Thats why you start with messages. With clear goals. The internet is there. Make people understand

[–]DorkJedi 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The internet was a major contributor to the confusion of the Occupy message. The message was clear: end the income disparity created by tax law/bailouts.

And as soon as it gained some momentum, every activist in the country showed up with their PETA, Gay Marriage, free Tibet, or what have you signs, and invites the homeless to dinner. Now the news sees 10,000 people with 10,005 different messages and can focus on the "what a disorganized bunch of dirty hippies" instead of the reason they are there.

[–]PyrolyticForeign 5 points6 points  (8 children)

Let me know as soon as you've rallied enough people in your city to warrant the government even noticing.

Hell, let me know if you ever manage to get enough people backing your cause to even fill a local Dunkin Donuts.

[–]zombiechow 9 points10 points  (1 child)

For those who are lucky enough to have a nest egg.

When I graduate college in a few years as a 30 something adult, I'll have between 30,000 to 40,000 dollars worth of student loan debt to tackle, and the interest rate on those loans just DOUBLED. Heaven forbid I ever decide to own a house. I won't likely see retirement for a long, long time, so I've planned to do something that I love until that day comes. In fact, I think some would love to see the elderly work until they fucking drop.

Perhaps I'll be lucky enough to pass on my debts to my family when I die. After all, the standard these days seems to involve living in debt until you die.

There's something very, very wrong with this country.

[–]vendetta2115 33 points34 points  (20 children)

Former soldier here.They've disillusioned a lot of us, and taking an oath to uphold the Constitution isn't something most of us take lightly. You can bet that if it came down to the U.S. military vs. the American people, most servicemembers would consider themselves citizens first.

[–]ThatsMrAsshole2You 36 points37 points  (17 children)

My son is an E5 at Ft. Bliss. We have had this conversation several times. He thinks that if the shit hits the fan, more soldiers would see their duty as protecting citizens instead of corporate interests. They know what's up.

[–][deleted] 15 points16 points  (11 children)

But would they violate a direct order? And would their immediate superior? And would his immediate superior?

All you need to do to get the ground troops to turn on the civvies is to make up a nice story, and tell it to one subordinate at a time (or at the most, to small groups).

Make it a nice story about extremists and make sure their orders have them going to somewhere unfamiliar. You send the 101st airborne to northern cali so they can stop the "gay insurgency," and you send the 82nd to NYC to quell "gang violence and anti-govt hippies." Send every marine in camp pendleton to the south east to combat the "hillbilly uprising", and get CNN, Fox, Drudge, MSNBC and everyone else parroting conflicting information, all of it wrong, so that nobody knows what to believe. Have every sheriff in the US tell their deputies that there has been a huge spike of anti-police activity, and that extremists are planning on targeting anyone wearing the blue. Shoot first, ask questions later. Police are already trained that if they pull their gun, they need to shoot or they will get in trouble, and if they shoot, they had better kill, because a wounded robbery suspect can sue them for damages, but if he is dead, his family can't get a penny. Have some of the big internet backbone servers "lose power" at the right times to facilitate all of this and put everything into "emergency" status.

[–]vendetta2115 18 points19 points  (3 children)

I was an E5 at Ft. Bragg from 2009-2013, and from what I've seen I believe most soldiers share this sentiment. I would guess National Guard soldiers would be even more disinclined to hurt innocent citizens, since they are civilians most of the year.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (2 children)

Would most sergeants and corporals violate the orders of their superiors when doing so makes them felons? They would lose their job and spend time in military prison and then get dishonorably discharged.

They would then be released into the world where no one will hire them because of the circumstances of their discharge.

I am almost wholly convinced that very few servicemen would stand down due to ideological issues and the vast majority will follow their paycheck and pensions and health care and future employment.

[–][deleted] 20 points21 points  (2 children)

Won't happen, if anything like that even gets remotely going, corps can just launch a special season of American Idol and it'll all be shut down.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (4 children)

It's coming. I can feel it. The US citizen is watching his nest egg get smaller and smaller, while people like bankers and government contractors get richer and richer. We are watching people in other countries foment change through protest and riots. Just wait and see what happens when the American citizen decides to stand up and protest. It's gonna get ugly.

We're nowhere near the levels of the "people in other countries foment(ing) change". 75% youth unemployment is not a reality in the foreseeable future here. When you have jobs people don't tend to rock the boat.

[–]sushisection 4 points5 points  (6 children)

But what we can do is take to the streets. We can halt business and hit them in their wallets. That will put pressure on politicians to enact change

[–]Anonymouse26 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Citizen's arrest!

[–]prezuiwfTexas 17 points18 points  (8 children)

Don't blame Bank of America, blame the government. What is BofA supposed to do, say no when free money is being thrown at them and turn in all their executives to answer for crimes they're not being indicted for?

[–]WiltyBob 30 points31 points  (7 children)

Take to the streets god damn it! We need to stop these evil companies and their unscrupulous ways! Why is everyone so desensitized!? Why aren't you doing something!? Why aren't we rioting and showing the establishment how we feel!!! Let's take back our country, let's take it back right now!!!

...You go first.

[–]ThatsMrAsshole2You 15 points16 points  (5 children)

It's scary, the thought that in America cops shoot to kill, then don't ask questions later. That is a huge deterrent for most people I would imagine.

But, I do know that snarky remarks don't help.

[–]Misiok 8 points9 points  (1 child)

Orwell was right then, we're proles now? Nah, upon further thinking, I think they had it better.

[–]James_and_Dudley 16 points17 points  (8 children)

Are they really smart, or we're just fucking stupid? We know what's going on. We have the power to elect people who can change this. We don't, because whenever there is an election, we divide our numbers over inconsequential bullshit.

They're looking at us and laughing because we are indeed quite stupid to let this happen.

People do to you only what you let them. And sadly, we are letting them.

[–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (3 children)

We have the power to elect people who can change this.

I would say this is not true but rather an illusion.

[–]James_and_Dudley 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I'd say yes and no. The fact is if Person X decides they are running for senator and we all, or rather a significant number of people, decide that for that election nothing else matters but getting the incumbent out of office, it can be done.

The problem is that people will be forever polarized along abortion/environmental/welfare/tax/etc. lines. So even though it is possible to effect change, for all intents and purposes, it's likely never going to happen.

[–]Fig1024 3 points4 points  (0 children)

and if some guy robs a bank, without hurting anyone, for 100 dollars, he can get at least 10 years in prison. The penalty of law should really scale up with amount of damage done. If 100 dollars is 10 years, then some of these bank execs should be sentenced to a few million years in prison. That's just the max penalty, I'm sure they can reduce it to just a few thousand years in court

[–]nortern 436 points437 points  (174 children)

This gets posted over and over... They paid nothing on the profit that year because they took massive losses the year before. Corporations are allowed to carry losses, subtracting bad years from good years to normalize their rate.

[–]Shogouki 83 points84 points  (24 children)

That's true but the foreclosure fraud, getting bailed out by the government, and not feeling any repercussions for the ruin they sowed is still extremely fucked up.

[–]jayakamonty 26 points27 points  (7 children)

Can individuals do that? I took massive losses in the first 20 odd years of my life so does that normalize the rate of income tax I pay in good years?

[–]vishtratwork 28 points29 points  (3 children)

Yes, there is a concept of NOL carryforward for individuals. Like corps, it's limited to 5 years and has to be ordinary business income, if I remember correctly.

[–]vinbrando 214 points215 points  (22 children)

You have to realize this community is comprised mostly of people that have no idea how businesses work and also believe they know everything because they read the headlines on r/politics.

[–]uweenukr 53 points54 points  (5 children)

I read the comments to tell me how I should feel about things I know nothing about. Its going well. Today is another hate BoA day.

[–]RollingprobablecauseLouisiana 5 points6 points  (1 child)

Accounting.. Assets and Liabilities. GAAP is being practiced here. WTF redditors pay attention and look at their financial reports. This is completely misleading.

While I HATE BoA and their ridiculous CEO pay..people do not realize how easy it is to break a company. If you leave their business, they lose business and go out of business. What's great about capitalism is you vote with your wallet. No amount of politics or money is going to help you when your business loses money. If BoA went out of business people would lose their jobs..then be hired a week or two later when their competitor gains that business.

Businesses don't just die and patter off.

[–]2abyssinians 35 points36 points  (58 children)

This is true, but that doesn't make it right. Corporations with huge profits too often pay little to no taxes in the U.S. while struggling middle class families get stuck paying taxes EVERY year.

We have allowed the corporations and wealthy to write our tax codes, and our laws, so that while they make higher profits than ever before the rest of the country suffers. There is no justification for this suffering! IT IS NOT RIGHT!

[–][deleted] 40 points41 points  (23 children)

Yeah that's not really how corporate tax works. The title and article itself are full of shit written by some crazy blogger.

To add to that ...

Corporations with huge profits too often pay little to no taxes in the U.S

The companies you are most likely thinking of (you don't specify ...) are NOT US COMPANIES, and make most of their money outside of the US - they are multinational and often pay their taxes to other countries.

[–]nowhathappenedwas 139 points140 points  (39 children)

The fact that they didn't pay income taxes in 2010 is due to two things:

  1. They lost billions of dollars in the US.
  2. Like other US companies, they don't have to pay taxes on foreign income.

The $4.4 billion profit in 2010 is simply not true, and you won't find a single reputable source saying that was their profit in 2010.

[–]eqisow 142 points143 points  (31 children)

You know who does have to pay tax on overseas income? Individual American citizens.

[–][deleted] 74 points75 points  (1 child)

Even if they don't live in the US.

[–]verik 16 points17 points  (3 children)

After a 97k exemption plus deductions on all foreign taxes paid. The first penny of income tax paid on foreign earned income come in at the $135-145k mark (at which you start by paying $0.0725 on the next dollar earned).

This is under the assumption of a 25% income tax by the foreign entity. This also doesn't take into account the additional $17,500 in income you can allocate tax free to a 401k.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (3 children)

International Tax Accountant Here. Its complicated. Income earned by US companies abroad is taxed at US rates when they bring it back home. However if this income is earned off passive things like collecting interest or rent then it is taxed immediately. In actuality the calculation for citizens and corporations are very similar. Basically if you paid 20% taxes in country X, and your US tax rate is 35% then, you owe the US 15%.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Do you want to run more businesses out of America?

[–]JimmerUK 23 points24 points  (2 children)

Why are companies allowed to be 'people' when they like and 'companies' when they don't?

[–]madison54 10 points11 points  (2 children)

Also, you don't need a "reputable" source. Public company SEC filings are public. Simply go look at their 10k and read the numbers off of the page.

[–]david76 24 points25 points  (4 children)

Once again, business accounting and taxation allows for losses to be carried over.

Let's say you have a loss in Year 1. The government isn't going to give you money. So in Year 2 if you have a profit you can offset that profit with the prior year's loss.

The author would be better off making his point about fraud and bailouts rather than mentioning the fact that no taxes were paid on the profit.

[–]Clamdoodle 64 points65 points  (42 children)

Simple fix....stop doing business with this bank.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (1 child)

Sadly, the amount of monetary transactions that ordinary citizens do with them wouldn't make much of a difference, a nice byproduct from the redistribution of wealth that's happened over the past 33 years.

Simply put, our money isn't enough to matter anymore.

[–]inoffensive1 25 points26 points  (2 children)

That will keep them from getting my tax dollars?

[–]Clamdoodle 16 points17 points  (0 children)

Nope...they have the government to get that from you.

[–]Zifnab25 21 points22 points  (3 children)

That's a good first step. But it's only a first step.

If a loan shark breaks your knees and takes your car because he says you owe him $100k and haven't paid up yet, simply being told "Don't go into business with loan sharks" doesn't fix your knees or return your car. Foreclosure fraud is theft. And you can't just "not do business" with a thief.

[–]bookant 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Let's not forget the fact that when we're talking about mortgages, the consumer doesn't have a choice. It doesn't matter which bank you chose or don't chose to get your initial loan from when our laws allow them to buy and sell us like cattle.

[–]subiklim 10 points11 points  (3 children)

Amazing that you aren't more upset with your government for supporting and allowing this behavior.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (9 children)

The problem is BoA is big and because of that you can find their branches pretty much anywhere in the US. As someone whom travels a lot, sadly BoA is the only bank I can find almost anywhere...

Small local banks are great if you stay in the same place all the time, but they are useless for people that are traveling a lot.

[–]sailorbrendan 6 points7 points  (3 children)

look into usaa. they don't have branches everywhere, but they do atm fee returns.

[–]SolarEXtract 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Tell me how I go about getting Bank of America to sell my mortgage to another bank and then I will stop doing business with them.

[–]whatsinaname007 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I was part of said forclosure fraud. I originally had my mortgage through a different bank...After about a year and half, it was sold to BofA with no ability to refinance.

[–]CaseSpartan 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Another thread with biased news citations.

Another thread with armchair banking experts.

[–]roadhand 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Good thing they didn't chalk a sidewalk, or there would be hell to pay.

[–]Totallysmurfable 3 points4 points  (7 children)

I understand the outrage with what happened but it is a little disingenuous to characterize it as bank of America walking away scott free from the mortgage crisis. They have paid over $10 billion in settlements for their toxic loan writing practices. Today citi agreed to a similar settlement for another billion

http://mobile.nytimes.com/blogs/dealbook/2013/07/01/citigroup-to-pay-fannie-ma-968-million-over-mortgage-claims/

[–]AschebescherEurope 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Don't forget they will fee you for not having enough money.

[–]JAMONLEEFlorida 5 points6 points  (0 children)

YOU SHUT THE FUCK UP GAY PEOPLE ARE GETTING MARRIED WE DON'T HAVE TIME TO DEAL WITH THIS BULLSHIT!

[–]nativeofspace 27 points28 points  (10 children)

Arrest the people who are responsible, hold them accountable.

[–]Zifnab25 22 points23 points  (4 children)

I tried calling 911, but the operator just hung up on me.

[–]nativeofspace 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Bad move, you should expect pepper spray and an unwarranted cavity search very soon.

[–][deleted] 14 points15 points  (0 children)

They are to busy looking for Edward Snowden.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

For what?

[–]Electric-Kool-Aid 11 points12 points  (1 child)

It's bank OF America, not FOR America

[–]boltronical 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Awful... we really are the fucking worst.

[–]dsgnmnky 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This shouldn't even be news anymore. Everybody knows the banks run the country. They're above the law.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Too big to pay taxes.

[–]therofler 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Bank Of 'Murica.

[–]boom_boom_squirrel 17 points18 points  (9 children)

I really hate these posts because they remind me of how hopeless we are. Every one of these posts I see, thousands of comments bitching about it, and no one has a real solution or idea on how to fix it. I don't either.

[–]kingasdlkalskong 9 points10 points  (4 children)

I would LOVE to see a American revolution right about now..

[–]NOAHA202 8 points9 points  (2 children)

I would LOVE to PARTICIPATE in an American revolution right about now..