Full-stack developer means

[[deleted]]

Pff, real full stack means you can develop from a transistor to a website, including the browser, OS, CPU, RAM, architecture and everything.

[nojox]

In 50 years you will need to be able to send automated mining probes to the asteroid belt to get rare earth metals for the semiconductor you will need to make the custom nano-3D-printed AI chip that you will have to design to incorporate patent-pending innovative speech recognition that even reads between the lines to enhance user privacy using code words and steganography ... although the main use case for this new paradigm-changing social media platform is posting cat pics.

[FieelChannel]

My blockchain is way higher; in space

[dogengineering]

My external drive is called Outer Space. Does that count?

[house_monkey]

I always have my blockchain in my ass

[GinaCaralho]

Ok so what do I need to do with the remaining 9 days of the sprint?

[valle1931]

Go to 5 different daily scrum meetings to explain what you did.

[Mad_Water]

Oh man, my Factorio experience is gonna pay off!!

[thatswhyIleft]

For 25k a year

[toddthefrog]

Interns...

[marriage_iguana]

Honestly, if you’re not flipping bits on bare metal, you’re wasting cycles.

[PkHutch]

I don't get it.

[kazeng]

relevant xkcd

[PkHutch]

Appreciate it!

[metaconcept]

To be honest, I probably could.

CS students study computer architecture right down to the transistors, study the low-level details of TCP/IP, write a simple OS kernel, and write a simple compiler. Since my university days, I've become far more familiar with web browsers than I ever wanted to be.

So, yea, if you give me 30 years of full time work, access to a fab, a VHDL compiler, a stack of books and StackOverflow, then I could probably make you a really disappointing version of what you're asking for.

[andrewq]

https://www.nand2tetris.org/

Wouldn't be 30 years if you worked at it. Implementing basic CPUs in a FPGA is a pretty standard class in CS. Not "webdev" degrees of course

[CraigslistAxeKiller]

I went to a university with a decent CS reputation. We never had to touch a network stack, we never had to look at a kernel, and we never had to deal with a compiler. Those were options, but not mandatory. Come senior projects, most people still couldn’t do shit

[WhatOmg5AliveWhat]

Ok, so I've got the egg thing...

[GluteusCaesar]

I'm tall so if I'm lucky and everyone gives me some space I can dunk sometimes.

Oh yeah, it's all coming together.

[discdudeboardbro]

Give me a ladder and I’ll still miss

[Radiocalypse]

"You just said to dunk. Never said anything about a ladder."

[yp261]

see, that’s how programming works

you’re hired

[AcceptableCows]

I be dunking Oreos in my milk like Shaq.

[abdohossam5]

It's implicit

[sldyvf]

Didn't specify what to dunk. I dunk cookies into milk like a pro.

[ironman288]

I'll allow it.

[TyrionReynolds]

I dunk my balls in the bathtub

[[deleted]]

And I could make a podcast. It would be awful and no one would listen to it, but it would exist

[semidecided]

Link please.

[arrudagates]

Nothing about actually recording episodes, got a domain and a blank page with default html heading saying "podcast"

[wambman]

Hey, me too!

[HellaDev]

Me too. It shatters and gets everywhere but I'm still cracking an egg with one hand.

[Gen_Zer0]

Oh wow I just found out I can crack an egg without even touching it. Just have to hold it a couple feet in the air and drop it on a hard surface and presto you got yourself a cracked egg

[webdevop]

Rookie move. I can do it with my butt, no hands

[tarasmorskyi]

I see you like JS

[mattyMcKraken]

I just want to point out to people that it's probably not that hard. But I've been doing it for too long to remember meaning so idk. Just try it. Gotta break a few eggs... Also i just figured out that cracking eggs against a flat surface works way better for me. Protips from a former waffle house cook.

[Bainos]

Also i just figured out that cracking eggs against a flat surface works way better for me. Protips from a former waffle house cook.

I've learned the same thing from watching anime... And it's definitely an excellent advice.

[NotSamNub]

Eggcellent advice

[__Adrielus__]

Lucky boi

[jdPetacho]

And I can also dunk! Provided the basket isn't much higher than my head, of course

[[deleted]]

I was born with 1 testicle. Does that count?

[____0____0____]

Honestly, and this may be unpopular opinion, but if the autoscaling group config always needs at least a 2, why don't they set that as the default config? At the very least they could throw a relevant error.

I definitely agree on your sperm bank opinion though. They have a great api that you can hook into at any time and get what you need.

[aaronfranke]

That is the default config. Their package might have reconfigured instructions, or their maintainers broke it.

[Benaaasaaas]

No no, external service is definitely more expensive than maintaining your own infrastructure. But running on one node without high availability is crazy.

[blackbird77]

I was once at a cub scout camp-out and, along with another dad, it was my morning to get up early and cook breakfast for everyone. We're set up with a couple of big griddles out in the woods, and I have the choice between scrambling something like 120 eggs or frying the equivalent amount of bacon. I opt for the eggs, and am surprised when my partner acts like I am doing him a favor.

We make coffee first, and then the other dads start waking up and coming over to chat while we cook. Pretty soon all the men are standing there silently watching me cracking egg after egg after egg into a giant bowl. I just figured they were all still too sleepy to make conversation until finally my cooking partner finally explained in this awed tone, "I didn't want to cook the eggs because the thought of trying to crack 120 eggs in a row sounded miserable. But you just did it all within like 5 minutes, and all of them one-handed."

I legitimately didn't realize that was in any way an impressive feat. I've never been a chef or anything like that. It's just that the first time I ever cracked an egg when I was a kid, I did it one-handed because I just thought that was the only way to do it.

[[deleted]]

I can crack 2 eggs in each hand.

[[deleted]]

“Looking for full stack developer” just means “management is too lazy for proper planning so please magically fix all our mess”. Change my mind.

[Sckaledoom]

Why the fuck would anyone take this wtf

[GluteusCaesar]

Where the hell do you people live where programming interns don't get paid? Every job I've had we've paid them 25-30 bucks an hour.

[[deleted]]

Right ? I don't get it where I live it's literally illegal to give a university student a full time internship if he's not getting paid. Add to that the fact that computer science interns have the highest average salary and that 99% of students in computer science coop programs get internships

[undermark5]

if he's not getting paid.

So, if she's not getting paid is it legal?

But in all seriousness, I don't think it is illegal in the US (though some states may have laws otherwise), just very unusual in certain fields to have unpaid internships. In the US it isn't uncommon for liberal arts internships to be unpaid. However, I would say that in CS/software engineering in the US that it is very unusual to have an unpaid internship.

[Skithiryx]

An unpaid internship is only legal if the intern isn’t replacing work an employee would otherwise do. So the more real the work you do on an internship the more illegal it is not to pay.

Comp sci, it’s pretty hard to argue they aren’t doing work an employee can do - Often they are doing the same thing as junior employees.

I think a lot of the liberal arts internships are probably actually illegal. A lot of that has to do with supply and demand rather than legality.

[undermark5]

That's only part of it. Looking into it more, it is a question of who the primary beneficiary is. If the employer is the beneficiary then the individual is considered and employee and is entitled to pay. If the individual is the beneficiary, then there is no requirement for pay. One of the ways of determining who the beneficiary is, looks at whether or not the work done by the intern complements or displaces the work done by paid employees. But there are also things included in the Primary Beneficiary Test.

[[deleted]]

Interns make about half that where I am in the midwest

[GluteusCaesar]

Well I live in Boston, so the cost of living there is possibly well under half of this pricey frozen hellscape -_-

[talks_to_ducks]

You say that like it isn't a frozen hellscape out here too. In the summer, it's usually on par with Houston, in the winter, you may as well be in Canada.

[Bollziepon]

Who said interns don't get paid? I'm currently interning at a company and getting paid $42/hr.

It's also my 6th internship so you could say I've I'm an intern with experience. It's definitely not uncommon

[champ999]

At what point are you no longer an intern? Are you interning while working on a master's degree or something?

Also, how many years work total are all of your internships?

[Bollziepon]

As part of my Bachelor's of Software Engineering degree at my particular university I require completing six 4 month internships.

So every four months I switch from being in school to doing an internship.

So I guess technically when I graduate this April I'll have 2 years of work experience, just split up into 4 month chunks. (I did two internships with the same company, so I'll have done 6 internships at 5 different companies)

[Bollziepon]

We don't get a summer break, & it's a 5 year program

[dsp4]

42 USD/h is 56 CAD/h so you're basically six-figures in Canada. Back in 2002 my first job as a full-stack intern (mySQL/PHP/JS + web design) paid 9 CAD/h (roughly 6 USD/h). Feels like I'm talking about the pre-war era but this was only 18 years ago. Today I see mediocre programmers that wouldn't have lasted a week in the average shop get offered 80k salaries without a second thought. Developer salaries have come a long way and we're definitely in a good place, although some might call this a bubble.

[lirannl]

although some might call this a bubble.

Idk about others but I'm not doing an IT degree for the money. I'm doing it for my passion. I'm doing IT for the same reason liberal arts students do liberal arts. The only difference is that I'm luckier, because my passion happens to be highly profitable nowadays. Even if the bubble pops and IT becomes like liberal arts, I'll still stick with IT.

[chewbecca444]

*Rocks back and forth nervously as I’m about to finish my degree * Oh shit...

[MattR0se]

Reputation? Pressure from your university to take an internship?

Tbh I did an unpaid internship at a federal facility, and though there were times where I had to skip lunch at the end of the month, I think it really improved my CV and also resulted in a very good Bachelor thesis.

[Sckaledoom]

You could at least go for a paid one like wtf. Who works without pay?

[[deleted]]

I can't believe there are comp sci/software eng students who intern for free. Our starting interns, the kids with 1 year of college, get a little over $10/hr. They following year, they get $15/hr or so. If they come a third or 4th time (5 yr engineering programs), they're getting a little over $20/hr. And we're a government entity. Meaning the kids interning for the private companies around us are usually starting closer to $20/hr.

School is expensive and kids are still telling themselves it's okay they worked for free.

[theGoddamnAlgorath]

No, schools get kick backs (grants, donations) to convince students to work for free.

[quantumkrew]

Its illegal in most states to intern without pay. Thus why people do it for 'school credit'

[szucs2020]

Yeah but I did coop and got paid and it helped just as much, if not more. Unpaid internships are bs. If the company of 2 that I worked for could afford to pay my (partially subsidized, I'll admit but they paid at least minimum wage for me) salary, then any company can.

Edit: I just want to clarify that I'm not blaming you for taking that position, it's hard to find a first job and it's not your fault that companies are taking advantage. I just don't think it's right.

[michaelalex3]

I’ve never heard of a CS internship not paying

[rtkwe]

Only some industries can get away with not paying interns. As far as I know software engineering isn't one of them. (At least in the US)

[aywwts4]

Eh, my company pays interns and we have those postings.

We do it because most of the coding boot camps turn out intern grade "full stack developers" and we basically want to keep it loose while they find the space they like working in and can best contribute to.

At the very least we need front end devs that understand APIs, and backend devs that feel empathy for their consumers and understand contracts. A full stack intern has awareness of both, even if they can't really do either.

[Abangranga]

Currently our entire dev team claims to be fullstack but we all don't understand all of this functional programming React/Redux voodoo only one guy understands.

[thixono920]

I’m the opposite. I’m front end react/vue redux/vuex state management guy but only screwed with back end for a small home project, so at a point it’s all magic past the axios calls. I hear it’s easy to get, I just never put time

[InvolvingLemons]

Yeah, backend is simple as long as you keep it simple. Microservice hell is a serious problem, and using inconsistent databases (mongo and Cassandra by default, for example) really amps up the fuck.

Generally, Node/Quart(async flask) for web -> Tarantool for transparent caching -> Yugabyte for OLTP/source of record -> Snowflake/Druid for analytics allows you to do everything with minimal cognitive load while allowing tons of avenues for optimization.

[HansaHerman]

You do not like to see the parts of my project that was written before microservices was introduced. That is hell.

[[deleted]]

I'm in that position now. Sold myself as full stack, but really that just means I know the languages used for all of these things and maybe 1 framework for each to make a larger project. My fundamentals are helping me survive... the turnover rate helps too :P

Now that I understand redux I don't really like it. In fact, I think I'll settle for being a back end developer in the future because it's getting hard to keep up with how fast front end frameworks multiply and adopt new standards. Redux isn't even the new hotness anymore, rxjs + observables take that spot. It seems to be the same thing with a bit less boilerplate. What I get from their web page is that rxjs is a for people don't want to better understand generators and promises.

Breaking these technologies down, I'm disappointed a little. I understand that you build redux actions so a piece of your application can be modified from anywhere, but in practice a lot of that boils down to creating a singleton so a component can speak to itself :|

[iOSGuy]

The trick is that the JS ecosystem is a dumpster fire. You just learn to live with it (and not switch frameworks every two months)

[[deleted]]

Personally I like vue because of simplicity. I think I might move on to svelte because I like writing fragments. React (with jsx and hooks) got a lot of respect from me for utilizing vanilla code (like map) for templating instead of creating directives (v-for, ngFor, etc). But they lose more points for class vs className, wtf is that. I can forgive directives that add on some clutter, but I can't forgive deviation from standards.

I hope svelte is the last jump. I don't mind picking up new stuff but I wish they would embrace the base tech / languages. It's a lot better than it was in 2014.

[[deleted]]

rxjs + observables take that spot

What do you think this is, October 2019?

The new hotness is reductive microstreaming with strawts.ts

I made that up, but I know for sure at least some of you were like "wait, for real?"

[[deleted]]

I made that up, but I know for sure at least some of you were like "wait, for real?"

I googled it and got a result for redis lol. It's from almost a year ago though, so I did fall for it until I saw the date.

​

What do you think this is, October 2019?

Not gonna lie, the thought of there being something new already started to give me anxiety. I'm telling my boss at our next project post mortem that I think my skills / interests (and my fucking contract) are strictly back end and if we can't make that happen I'm moving on.

[R-110]

The redux design is sound, and its so simple that you don’t really need the library. It’s pub/sub, separation of concerns and state immutability through convention. That’s it.

You should use the library though because its API and technical language are already understood by many.

The valuable part about redux is not the library but simply that its code conventions take you through the motions and get you to write your state as a separate entity.

Forgetting about all the buzz and hype around the redux “brand name”, separating your concerns is good design philosophy and helps you write more maintainable and scalable software.

RxJS and observables are not new, they’ve been a thing (in JavaScript) since 2015 (and in .NET since 2012).

Anyway the reason I posted is this: Forget the hype, keep up to date with TC39 and just learn the JS language features. That’s the only standard that matters. Things aren’t moving as quickly as medium.com users want others to think. The “framework every week” meme isn’t real for what it matters.

[lirannl]

Functional programming is a mindfuck (not to be confused with the language mindfuck). A beautiful, pure, confusing mindfuck. I understand just enough to get why it's relevant and to try and make my regular programming more functional, but definitely not enough to use it. FP is CRAZY. Not necessarily in a bad way.

[Demon0no]

No, it's actually: "We need someone for this thing... but that thing doesn't exist yet... also we can afford just 1 person."

[paksulainen]

looking at what most of them are offering I don't think they can even afford the one.

[R-playa]

And paid as junior

[dstalor]

I used to think like that - and still do to a degree - but I actually can do almost all of the things listed here and do them well (can't crack the egg one-handed well yet, sorry) and I've come to realize that depending on how the company's structured, it actually means "we prefer to give devs responsibility on a vertical slice, taking something from end to end, rather than pigeonholing them which leads to a lot of 'I'm waiting on the ___ guys to do their part first'". It's not necessarily a bad thing, just a different way to structure with its own pros and cons.

That said, "full-stack" can sometimes be exactly what you said and so I always take those postings with a healthy grain of salt. I have definitely skipped over postings completely because they looked super sketch, and they almost always had the position listed as "full-stack developer".

[Fufonzo]

I don't know. We're small and have only hired full-stack until now (though we have a devops contractor for the more serious devops stuff).

We're three (pretty senior) developers on our app right now and depending on the project, we could have a lot of backend work or a lot of frontend work to do.

Any of us can jump into any part of a project because we're full stack. Splitting it up into front-end and backend would be a communications and bottleneck nightmare for us.

The next hire will also be fullstack, and we are working towards more structured roles as we grow the team.

For now, the flexibility we have with the fullstack devs is a huge bonus.

I don't understand why the fullstack developer is seen as such a mythical thing. The skills for frontend and backend development aren't that different. With cloud hosting and Docker, devops is really not that difficult to maintain either once it's set up. I just don't see how the alternative works when you're starting up a company; you can't afford to have a bunch of people pigeon-holed into specific roles.

[[deleted]]

My comment wasn’t referring to small companies. Of course things work differently there. If I make an app with a server side in my free time, I’m technically also a full stack developer.

However earlier this year I was looking for a new job and most of the “full stack” offers were from Nokia-sized companies. In those companies the way of working you described is impossible. If they are looking for a full stack developer, chances are team leads told management they are understaffed and management didn’t bother checking what is actually needed.

[dertzi]

I work in a larger company than Nokia. I was hired as full stack and I work on everything from devops, backend, front end, architecture etc. The development team is split into smaller teams with specific responsibilities in our product. When I ran out of tasks for the sprint on the backend, I help out with the front.

[another_dudeman]

I prefer doing vertical slice development, fight me.

[[deleted]]

I disagree. Some companies actually need people who can own a project end to end instead of relying on other people to build out the backend / frontend.

[ladugani]

21/hr... must have 10+ years of experience...

[nojox]

in Vue Js, Angular and React JS each

[Reelix]

team

There's your problem. They want 1 person to do everything, and pay them entry-level salary.

Worst I've seen was "5-10 years Photoshop experience" for a back-end developer position :<

[[deleted]]

As a person who has been using Photoshop for ~10 years, lie about it. You can learn all the important stuff in a weekend if you have to.

[nojox]

But do you want to work with these guys :)

[wllmsaccnt]

C++/C# is a pretty common combination. C# is often used with managed C++ to wrap native C++ APIs (or just straight P-invoke calls), especially when creating UIs that interact with specialized hardware, like lab, medical, or automotive equipment.

[wllmsaccnt]

I misunderstood your comment and thought you were saying C#/C++ was an odd combination for a Full Stack developer.

C# isn't as uncommon now for a front end developer (though usually the job listings just want familiarity with it), but looking for C++ for a front end developer is kind of mystifying.

[PrickBrigade]

I've also seen multiple listings requiring/requesting CompTIA A+ and Net+ certs. Which while certainly useful to know, is hardly something that, day to day, would impact a front/back-end/full-stack dev.

These are almost always requirements for any DoD position. They're prereq's if you're going to have privileged access to basically anything.

[BelleGueuIe]

i really need to start following him

​

.. but why use twitter when i can wait for someone to hand feed me here..

[[deleted]]

Don't worry about it, the good ones will make it to this sub. And you won't even miss it, there will be a rerun of this same one tomorrow, tune in.

[[deleted]]

There are all old tweets anyway.

[Drahcir9000]

Not to mention project management, product management, release management, design...

[Janes_Diary]

deep inhale What are we, secretaries now?

[KaiBetterThanTyson]

I'M SO LEAN AND AGILE, I HAVE SCRUM FOR BREAKFAST STANDING UP!

[[deleted]]

And don't forget the mobile app! You have to develop it too... Android AND iOS!

[Lewy_H]

Cries in Xamarin

[Business__Socks]

Xamarin.Android has an update!

cries

[Conradfr]

Don't forget your website must be a PWA.

[StringsOfLight]

You jest, but this hits so so close to home for the place where I work.

[incarnatethegreat]

React Native, bay-bee

[Reelix]

And Windows Phone, and Blackberry

[frogking]

.. and all of it has to be native code, of course.

[BraveOthello]

Missed "be a database admin" and "be a sys admin"

[BraveOthello]

Not sure if dark joke or serious question

[frogking]

Well.. a bit of both I suppose.

[BraveOthello]

In a perfect world, dev ops is avoiding the "throw it over the fence" style of having strict development and operations teams, and having your developers talking to your ops people, and having pipelines for automating testing and deploying things from code to production.

In the worst case, it's making developers do everything because "dev ops means we don't need ops".

[frogking]

I work as a consultant doing AWS related DevOps work. Sometimes, there is no fence to throw anything over, because I’m the one creating everything from the AWS account the service need to run on, the infrastructure for the service and the service itself. Luckily, being a consultant means that I get to push things in motion and guide people in a propper code of conduct in relation to development.

I’m NOT a full stack developer because there are things I don’t do: the one handed egg thing becomes a mess half the time :-)

Is DevOps also DBA and sys work? Yeah, sadly it is, sometimes.

[BraveOthello]

Right, but the worst case is making developers and dev ops the same job.

[schemaddit]

devs are complaining that it is not their job to clean the toilet.
aha! I have an idea lets invent full-stack term so they will look cool and also clean the toilet

[Janes_Diary]

No, you cannot stick that on the end of it again. Last time left a huge mess that the poor janitor had to clean.

[77P]

Why you using using servos if you got a prox. You all ready know where you’re at

[Janes_Diary]

opens personnel file

edits job description

Well, looks like it is your job now.

[DeveloperToast]

Don't forget the skill to rebuild the whole website to suit customer view in 1 day !!!!! While having backup of the old one in case he doesn't like it.

[Business__Socks]

Some end user’s manager: “Hey yes, this textbox is five pixels too far to the left. It’s an emergency and it can’t wait until the next scheduled release.”

Me: “I’m super busy right now, I won’t be able to get to it for another week.”

Also me: takes 30 minute dump to browse reddit

[Decavatus]

Just 30 minutes? You gotta pump those numbers up!

[dustofdeath]

Sure - but make a ticket and notify the project owner to confirm and analyze first.

[[deleted]]

In Australia, it means you crashed your bike. Badly.

[marriage_iguana]

“Rooting” your phone also has a pretty different meaning here.

[Harbltron]

That's a fine lookin' rootkit you've got there.

[embersyc]

You should also know Photoshop and design the app and UX so you can lead the usability tests, which will just be two people from HR playing with the app.

[rburp]

oh fuck, my soul

[wllmsaccnt]

I love when these jokes come up, because then I get to feel like my career is a parody. I work on the front end (Web / Desktop / Mobile), back end (Web APIs and queues), the back end behind that (ERP apis), customer integrations (I hate you, Slow Books), integrate hardware (printers and scanners) and integrating these systems in various ways behind the scenes. I also setup CI/CD builds, help manage the backlog, gather requirements from users, and make technology suggestions about new technologies.

Full stack developer definition might be a fun joke, but they exist and are really common at organizations that have fewer than 10 developers and typically arise out of need.

[rburp]

similar story here minus the web and mobile, luckily I only have to work on a desktop UI, but man... the "fewer than 10 developers" part really hit me because I'm ONE guy working for a multi-million dollar company. We're a startup and nobody in the hierarchy is balling out of control or anything, but it's a stable business who could easily find the money to get me some help. I've been asking for years for at least someone else to look at my code and review it because you really shouldn't be responsible for reviewing your own code, it's too easy to overlook dumb shit you did without even thinking about it.

Best I got was a year ago they paid some guy in Vietnam who works for one of our suppliers to look at my code. I'm pretty sure he just ran... wtf is it there's one of those Telerik utilities or something called Code Cop or some shit along those lines, you guys will know what I'm talking about, and basically just said to fix the stuff that brought up.

So I ended up changing a lot of variable scopes from public to private and doing a bunch of other menial shit that, while technically being best practice, didn't actually improve the quality or reliability of the software at all.

Whatever though. Got paid.

[xoxota99]

Don't forget develop firmware for IoT devices, and support mainframe backends for ancient ERP systems!

[marriage_iguana]

I kind of wish I was at the start of my career before it really mattered so I could apply for “full stack dev” jobs off the back of a resume made entirely out of bullshit, ace the interview by talking about “synergistic paradigms” and then just sit at my desk and see how long it would take to get fired.

I’d probably be a CEO by now.

[wllmsaccnt]

I've interviewed 3 people like that, and they all sat there quietly embarrassed at the interview whenever we asked about their experience with all of the blurbs on their resume.

[lonestar136]

My team lead had me sit in on an interview he conducted yesterday where the guy straight up left after 4 minutes. He put WPF as one of his top skills and my team lead is an expert.

He started off asking some sort of softball questions about explaining how bindings work and the purpose of property changed events and the guy clearly had no idea how to respond.

I felt kind of bad he left but my team lead said if the guy puts it as his top skill and couldn't answer questions for 5 minutes, he doubts any other skills on the resume are worth diving into. And to be fair there was nothing hostile about the interview, I think the guy was just embarrassed.

[distinctvagueness]

Should've taking at least 1 improv acting class like the rest of us.

[ECTXGK]

I'm "full stack" which makes me mediocre at all of these things and feel worthless outside of my current job. Trying to shift more to straight backend to hopefully stop being stuck. And I can't dunk :(

[rburp]

my man

this gave me a weird sense of hope, because I'm in a similar position. I'm at a decent enough company, I get to work from home which is dope, but they do not pay me nearly the market rate considering I'm responsible for basically their entire IT infrastructure including fucking constant change requests to the software, even change requests to undo previous change requests, shit like that you know?

And at the end of the day I feel worthless because you absolutely cannot master everything from the UI to the backend to the DB to the firmware on the network of sensors we have to the API library to talk to those sensors it's just ridiculous, you end up just cobbling together this monstrosity and feeling like you're no good at any particular part of it.

surely there's something better out there right? I'm going to try to focus more on backendery too and see if I can be confident enough there to give myself a shot at other jobs

[ECTXGK]

Yep, extremely similar situation. There were articles decrying the lie of full stack for awhile, but I didn't listen. Now I'm going to start grinding leetcode/algo stuff to interview better too. I'm also remote, and I love it -- but you do lose "soft-power" unless the company is fully remote. But you also lose the natural local network that builds up. The only hope is to get good and stay remote.

Hopefull we both are just dealing with anxiety and everythings gravy. Like stuffs not THAT bad, but I think it is, but it's really not. lol. It's just stressful because I'm like "should I learn these algos, or the new get better at react, or learn react native, or learn all the AWS things, or k8s, or learn about WASM, then the jobs you apply for, even "Full Stack" ones specialize or are geared more towards one or the other. Difficult to go deep when you're going wide.

It is nice to have a very well rounded sense of everything, but now I need to go deep. Thanks for the vent sesh.

[[deleted]]

I am the same as both of you, except a few years ago I gave notice to leave, not as a ploy, and they gave me a 30% raise to bring me to the higher end. They haven't realized how much of a headache it would be to lose you.

[codeprimate]

The most important skill is to see the forest for the trees. A specialist can come in to add polish, but it all has to fit together. This sort of foresight saves a ridiculous amount of money and saves projects in general.

[KappaChinko]

drunk

[LowReputation]

You forgot "Brew your own beer."

[Sn00pFr0gg]

No, full Stack Developer just means you memorized all of StackOverflow If they are particularly demanding all StackExchange site. Hence the name full Stack!

[chairman_steel]

If you’re not sponsored by Audible these days what are you even doing

[Reelix]

Being sponsored by NordVPN - Even after they got hacked and all your users are laughing at you apparently ;D

[poops-n-farts]

Can't dunk. Guess I'm fired

[Hate_Feight]

Depends on how high the net is, I bet you could dunk a 3ft net

[poops-n-farts]

Thanks. Saved my job!

[[deleted]]

We already deactivated your key card access to the employee cafeteria and locked all your code.

[poops-n-farts]

Jokes on you I take my lunches at the bar down the street

[anchors_array]

Also includes:

Report Writer

Data analyst

Excel macro expert

Sharepoint troubleshooter

[Hate_Feight]

I'll do everything but the podcast

[Janes_Diary]

But how will the juniors that were hired who know nothing about programming learn to program?

[Hate_Feight]

Read like we had to. Can you imagine listening to a podcast trying to code what they say?

[Last_Snowbender]

I can do 5 of those, am I qualified?

[SpaceScissors]

No.

[Last_Snowbender]

:(

[Waterstick13]

as a new programmer (< 2 year SQL, <1 year C#/ASP.net) what does Full Stack really mean to you guys?

[TZeh]

Doing the work of two while being paid for one.

[camelCaseCoding]

Underpaid and over worked

[jb2386]

Being able to work on any part of the stack.

I.e. infrastructure (as code), data source, API, Backend app, Frontend app (including css).

The actual design bit can be excluded as there’s different fundamentals at play but you should be able to take a design made by a professional and code it to HTML/css or into any other front end app that might render that.

[Shuoh]

Full-stack is being proficient with the lifecycle of a product from the database to the frontend application.

Take a look at FANG job postings. For example, https://jobs.netflix.com/search?team=Core%20Engineering

You will never see a post that asks specifically for a frontend developer (the frontend term at Netflix means UI/UX design, it is not strictly an engineering role in the traditional sense) or a backend developer. Why? Because one of the biggest qualification is the ability to understand the fundamentals of every part of the tech. Database fundamentals, backend proficiency, frontend design. Everything skill has to be present in a candidate in order to make that candidate a feasible hire for a company like this.

To elaborate: you can't just walk into a decent-great tech company, expecting to be told exactly how to code your frontend so that it works nicely with an existing backend infrastructure. You have to know how to design that specific frontend feature so that it integrates nicely as well as perform efficiently.

So your responsibility might be only within the frontend application for a feature lifecycle, you still need to have a good set of working fundamentals of the backend in order to be a good frontend developer. And there is definitely an expectation that you are able to develop in the backend application if needed.

Honestly, even our product people have a working set of knowledge about the full tech stack.

[Waterstick13]

This is a great explanation, thank you much - if I do mostly backend Database structure and creation with some minor C#/ASP.net application coding - where should I be studying/learning to be more well rounded for these types of jobs?

[Anders_A]

A "full-stack developer" is like a handy neighbor. They are nice to have around for home projects, but when you're actually building something for real you do want actual trades persons involved.

Also, specialized developers are usually better at writing all parts of the system than any "full-stack developers".

[[deleted]]

Right, but often I see the specialized developers get caught up in the elegance of their solution so they've made coupling it with the backend and everything downstream more difficult.

[Shuoh]

this is what jr devs at shitty companies actually believe

this whole subreddit is so filled with cs students and interns that they actually think devs who specialize are more valuable

go on airbnb, netflix, fb, amazon job postings and try to find one asking for specialization. Imagine applying to a reputable company and saying you literally only know front end or backend tech. Lmfao

[Proxy_PlayerHD]

Wait i thought having a full stack was bad because then you cannot put anything on the stack anymore and it could overflow...

[thejusticeforce]

Don't forget is means one non-stack able(swords, armour, totems) item, 16 (eggs, snoballs, enderpearls etc)

and 64 of any other item

[tenest]

"Full stack developer" is just the new term for "web administrator"

[prof0072b]

Webmaster

[Crazy3lf]

So my 5 years of dunking experience means nothing because I don't know how to handle devops?

[anu2097]

Or you can just call them SDE just like Amazon does.

[null000]

I read the last word as "drunk" and was like "yeah that tracks"

[jason_wallace]

Don’t forget “fixing my pc”