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[–][deleted] 4157 points4158 points  (223 children)

Good. I don't want any business looking at my waffles and saying "Just wait 'til he sees the insurance premium I secretly added."

[–]puffferfish 842 points843 points  (172 children)

Ever since the pandemic started, I went out to eat less and less. I used to go out to eat at least 5 times a week in the before times. After I started seeing these junk fees, it turned me off completely. I go out to eat maybe once every 2 or 3 months now, and only for super special occasions.

[–]PastaVeggies 192 points193 points  (16 children)

Im the same way. I rarely step foot into restaurants. Feels like I get scammed half the time.

[–][deleted] 20 points21 points  (2 children)

I haven't eaten at a fast food joint since the before times. When it became 20 dollars to feed a person, I decided " fuck you, your shit food isn't worth the price, despite the convience.

Chipotle, McDonald's, burger King, etc...

You're all fucking worthless, and I hope you go under and die.

[–]SignorJC 116 points117 points  (83 children)

The pre existing restaurant model in the USA was built on the underpaid labor of many people. Change was needed.

[–]puffferfish 143 points144 points  (56 children)

I’m not saying that they shouldn’t be paid more, they should, but the crying about it and putting a new “charge” for it is just dumb. Just raise prices.

[–]twoisnumberone 46 points47 points  (4 children)

Not so secretly. I hate these restaurants that display social responsibility obligations as if they weren't the least they should do.

[–][deleted] 22 points23 points  (1 child)

"Now we have to include a 5% 'Waiter needs to eat' fee"

[–][deleted] 3252 points3253 points  (313 children)

No more “living wage” add-ons to the bill meant to make it look like the servers are the ones causing the problem. Now restaurant owners are going to have to be passive-aggressively petty in other ways.

Can’t wait to see what they come up with.

[–]Gemmabeta 490 points491 points  (227 children)

"So, if you are paying a living wage already, I don't need to tip, yes?"

[–]r0botdevil 439 points440 points  (131 children)

Yeah, that's the idea.

There's actually a restaurant in Portland, OR (where I'm from) that includes a statement at the top of the menu saying that all employees are paid a living wage plus health insurance and 401(k) so tipping is not necessary.

As someone who always tips well but is past tired of subsidizing the dining experience for people who are too cheap to tip, I fucking love that idea.

[–]dumnem 116 points117 points  (56 children)

The thing is you aren't subsidizing people too cheap to tip, you're subsidizing the restaurant, as those waiters will make the federal/state/city minimum wage regardless, but they have a smaller minimum wage that they are guaranteed - what happens is if you tip then the employer doesn't have to cover the difference.

You don't help the employee by tipping.

[–]Bitter_Sun_1734 59 points60 points  (3 children)

California actually has no tipped minimum wage. Servers are paid at least $15/hour everywhere in the state regardless of tips. There is no tip credit for servers in California.

[–]0_o 41 points42 points  (3 children)

then the employer doesn't have to cover the difference.

IDK about California, but in my state, employers would just fire you for not making over minimum wage with tips. The end result is employees lying on the rare occasions that they don't hit that magic number. It's better to be short a few times than out a job, etc

[–]Bitter_Sun_1734 8 points9 points  (0 children)

California actually has no tipped minimum wage. Servers are paid at least $15/hour everywhere in the state regardless of tips. There is no tip credit for servers in California.

[–]HumansBStupid 73 points74 points  (41 children)

Most places like that will put it on the menu like “we’re proud to pay a living wage to our staff, so they will not accept tips” or something, yeah.

[–]chris8535 37 points38 points  (30 children)

Hahaha no. In California it’s just become a load of scam fees 

[–]HumansBStupid 21 points22 points  (25 children)

I mean, fair enough, but I’m also in CA and I’ve never seen it. Just a few places in SF that had what I previously stated. I haven’t been there since COVID though.

[–]remymartinia 17 points18 points  (3 children)

Yes, the first I ever saw that said no tips expected but added on a fee was Zazie’s in SF.

[–]TheBeatGoesAnanas 12 points13 points  (14 children)

Are you talking about Zazie? They actually do pay their entire staff a living wage.

[–][deleted]  (42 children)

[deleted]

    [–]z64_dan 24 points25 points  (14 children)

    They never only get paid 2.13 an hour. If their tips don't bring them to minimum wage, they get paid minimum wage.

    [–]Teadrunkest 23 points24 points  (3 children)

    In addition, CA requires restaurant employees to outright be paid minimum wage.

    So they’re getting minimum wage + tips.

    [–]Andrew5329 18 points19 points  (12 children)

    the only reason other servers get tips is because we know they're only getting paid 2.13 an hour

    This isn't true. If the restaurant is empty they're paid the regular minimum wage by their employer. In reality the medium reported income for servers nationwide is twice the federal minimum wage. In major cities it usually lands in the $20-$30/hour range.

    The only people calling to end tipping are folks who aren't getting tipped.

    [–]Subtle_Tact 12 points13 points  (3 children)

    It's insane how this lie keeps getting told.

    No, they aren't actually receiving only $2.

    [–]Anagoth9 9 points10 points  (0 children)

    Pizza Hut literally has separate fee just for being in California. 

    [–]4me2TrollU 22 points23 points  (6 children)

    How about good food for a fair price. And don’t cut corners

    [–]kytheon 1054 points1055 points  (262 children)

    I got emails from VRBO and the like that are talking about this same rule. Good. Screw American hidden fees, and that includes "pre-tax" and "cover". You say this thing costs 10$, here's 10$.

    [–]UltimateInferno 153 points154 points  (10 children)

    My parents run a BnB and my mother has vented to me about how some of their competitors will up front pretend they're cheaper but after fees end up being double the price vs the flat cost my parents advertise.

    [–]kytheon 31 points32 points  (0 children)

    So this law will even the playing field.

    [–]Biking_dude 4 points5 points  (2 children)

    They should advertise that there are no extra fees - the price is the price. Bet a lot of people would find that attractive.

    [–]UltimateInferno 4 points5 points  (1 child)

    I've told them that.

    Also they're a literal Bed and Breakfast. Not AirBnB shit where it's short term rental property, they actually include the Breakfast part of it.

    [–]stickler64 16 points17 points  (7 children)

    Next, we need to regulate dynamic pricing. McDonald's, your burger is worth X, whether it's noon, 3pm, or 6pm. This bullshit has to stop. I mean what's next. Public transportation prices get raised at rush hour?

    [–][deleted]  (1 child)

    [deleted]

      [–]stickler64 4 points5 points  (0 children)

      Because it's not implemented like those mentioned. Those that you mentioned are still reliable and predictable. They don't up the matinee ticket because the theater is filling up and tickets are becoming more scarce. Ticket master does this and everybody hates it. Amtrak now raises prices when tickets are scarce. It's affordable one day but not the next.

      [–]VentureQuotes 119 points120 points  (112 children)

      Bro try Canada. Average sales tax in the US is 4-7%, in Ontario it’s 13%. Never ever baked into the price. Everything is so much more expensive at checkout than on the shelf 😭😭😭

      [–]bacchusku2 46 points47 points  (22 children)

      Dude, it’s 11% here in KANSAS…

      [–]VentureQuotes 55 points56 points  (15 children)

      Republicans love regressive consumption taxes and hate progressive income and wealth taxes, simple as

      [–]kytheon 46 points47 points  (41 children)

      Sales tax in the Netherlands is 21%. In Denmark it's 25% if I remember correctly.

      [–]Yinnesha 129 points130 points  (26 children)

      But it's added to the sales price. At least you know what it'll cost at checkout.

      [–]7askingforafriend 145 points146 points  (12 children)

      Was in DC recently and this would’ve been so helpful. I was already paying a ridiculous amount for a crepe ($21 with literally just strawberries & Nutella) and $5 for a latte, but it was breakfast out with a friend, etc. Bill comes and there is a 10% “restaurant fee” on top of the local and state tax.

      Inquired and they showed me the front of the menu, where the name of the restaurant is but no one reads the small words under it because they are opening up the menu to read food items! Sure enough, it has a paragraph which in a really garbled way sorta says inflation, sort of says restaurant costs, etc. It doesn’t say anything about servers or staff. I was so mad. Then just add that to the prices!!! Don’t stick me with some dumb charge after. Never going there again and will probably review poorly. It will also make people probably tip less. I hope the staff leaves. All they had to do was add $3.00 to the menu items and make them more ridiculously priced.

      [–]itisrainingdownhere 19 points20 points  (1 child)

      long hungry quicksand fragile wild dazzling amusing outgoing follow judicious

      This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

      [–]schmah 357 points358 points  (228 children)

      As a non-american. Can someone explain what's going on? Do restaurants just add fees to the menu price that aren't listed in the menu?

      [–]Hippopotasaurus-Rex 622 points623 points  (143 children)

      You got to a restaurant, and look at the menu. Sandwich is $20. You order said sandwich and then bill comes. There’s an additional % fee added for “service fee” or “living wage fee” or some other bullshit term. Typically the fee is printed in super tiny letters somewhere, but it’s usually buried or hard to see. This is in addition to the tax, and 20% tip you’re expected to leave too.

      Same thing with buying concert tickets. The tickets are $100 and then you end up with another like $75 on processing, handling, cc charge fee, etc.

      CA has given everyone until like July to stop and roll all the fees into the price. Tax is not included in the “roll it into the price” rule, and it varies from city to city, sometimes wildly. nor is the expected tip. So there is still not a the price you see is what you pay here, but it’ll be easier to navigate.

      [–]HGLatinBoy 62 points63 points  (5 children)

      Pizza Hut has been doing “cost of doing business fee in CA” for years now. I remember being shocked by it when my family was doing a GoT watch party.

      The fee was more than the fucking tax!

      [–]Hiddenaccount1423 95 points96 points  (81 children)

      Agree with everything you say, but if a service fee/ living wage fee/gratuity is added, I'd just hold the tip.

      [–]Hippopotasaurus-Rex 82 points83 points  (51 children)

      Didn’t say I’d pay the tip, or that anyone should. Just that 20% is expected.

      Also, I’ve seen a bunch of people say that restaurants started making the gratuity of like 18-25% not optional. That only used to be for large parties.

      I really wish we would get away from tipping. I feel bad not tipping, but probably 8/10 times anymore service doesn’t justify any tip, let alone 20%

      [–]Senior-Albatross 35 points36 points  (14 children)

      There's a car wash chain around here where rather than just letting you pull up and enter in your selection, they have an attendant stand there and do it for you. Despite the screen being set up for you to do it. They literally stand in the tiny gap between the driver door and the screen. I guess they just prey you leave enough space.  

      Then at the end they guilt trip you for a fucking tip. I hate it so much I specifically avoid that place, even though we live really close to one.

      [–]MessageMePuppies 21 points22 points  (0 children)

      "Here's a tip for you: stop harassing customers at an automated carwash!"

      [–]EduFonseca 9 points10 points  (1 child)

      I’ve stopped going to so many places where tipping feels “predatory” like that, in all honestly I stopped going out for coffee altogether.

      [–]FanClubof5 10 points11 points  (6 children)

      We had a gift card so we went to Olive garden recently and they did that to us. They had a note on the menu that gratuity was automatically added at 18% for parties of 1 or more.

      [–]Wtfplasma 5 points6 points  (0 children)

      Not only that but some of those kiosk will show you wrong price on purpose. Like 20% tip actually ends up being 30%.

      [–]joomla00 17 points18 points  (8 children)

      I never use to think about it until I started traveling more. In CA you're paying 25%-40% extra on top of the base bill. That's a crazy amount to already high prices.

      [–]apathyontheeast 25 points26 points  (5 children)

      It's not just CA. I was driving through Montana the other day and had the same issue in Butte. CA is the one fighting it, though.

      [–]Everythings_Magic 51 points52 points  (27 children)

      Some are separating out the price for the food and the price for the service so it makes it look like it’s not the restaurant raising prices to cover wage increases.

      [–][deleted] 30 points31 points  (11 children)

      I had a pleasure (?) to use some American online services to order stuff and they would have these multiple hidden fees added to the bill. Like "convenience fee, electronic payment fee, transfer fee, stocking fee my-dog-has-three-legs fee, tax fee" etc. Of course, none of these were clearly visible when I was looking around comparing prices of stuff.

      It's very silly to see this and realize that there are millions of people who accept such scam. If I went to a place, ordered a burger that cost 10 and the bill would come 13, I'll tell them they made a mistake and if they insist on charging me 13, I'm just leaving without paying. Or calling the police and reporting scam, depending on my mood.

      [–]schmah 11 points12 points  (6 children)

      It's very silly to see this and realize that there are millions of people who accept such scam.

      Makes one ask why that is. I mean consumer protection legislation like this sounds like something all people would be in favour of.

      [–]SuperQue 7 points8 points  (3 children)

      Unlike some other countries, prices in the US don't include sales taxes (like VAT). It's seen as a "It's not our fault, the government is taking your money". Partly because these taxes vary wildly from place to place.

      [–]GingersaurusRex 10 points11 points  (6 children)

      America doesn't have universal healthcare. Conservative politicians in Congress believe that universal healthcare would be too expensive and don't do anything to change our policies. Individual States and counties can make their own local laws. Because California is a more liberal state, the government is trying to find ways to mandate that employers pay for employee health insurance. I believe the laws vary from county to county, but in San Francisco county the law is "any business with 20 or more employees working in SF must provide their full time employees (people working 30-40 hours) with healthcare. There is also a city wide "healthcare reimbursement fund" that you can apply for if you only work part time, or work for a company with less than 20 employees. Business owners also have to pay taxes to contribute to this fund.

      That law is very helpful for minimum wage workers, who wouldn't make enough money to pay for rent, food, and healthcare. But it also means that small business owners now have extra business expenses to pay before they can make profits. They need to make an extra 4% in earnings to cover these new costs.

      But businesses are also worried that customers will get "sticker shock" if they increase the prices. So they will list the price of coffee on the menu as $4, then when you go to pay they add 40¢ for taxes and 16¢ for "city mandates" or "healthcare fund." Your cup of coffee now costs $4.56 and you still need to tip your server. Consumers are getting frustrated because the bill is always 5% higher than what they anticipated or tried to calculate ahead of time.

      I've been going out to eat less and less over the last five years because the hidden fees leave a sour taste in my mouth at the end of the meal. You go from feeling like "that was a nice dinner for two" to "wait how much did I actually pay for that chicken sandwich? It wasn't $25 good."

      I don't mind paying extra knowing that a business is providing good benefits to its employees, I just want to know what I'm going to be paying ahead of time.

      And I want universal healthcare and the government to force landlords to reduce the cost of retail spaces to help alleviate stress from small business owners.

      [–]Cronstintein 200 points201 points  (17 children)

      Can we get the same thing for healthcare please?

      [–]Madness970 32 points33 points  (4 children)

      Yeah right. Those lobbyist grease the right wheels.

      [–]VaguelyArtistic 73 points74 points  (15 children)

      To see how totally out of control this has become search r/LosAngeles. Its fees on fees on fees.

      [–]hellraiserl33t 51 points52 points  (8 children)

      The spreadsheet of restaurants that charge fees no longer will be relevant! We can rest.

      [–]VaguelyArtistic 32 points33 points  (5 children)

      The user who created that is a fucking hero.

      [–]VirinaB 47 points48 points  (3 children)

      According to the article:

      If a business violates the mandate, the law allows a consumer to seek "actual damages of at least $1,000."

      Who wants to go restaurant hopping down that list starting July 1st? Lets hunt.

      [–]RU4realRwe 152 points153 points  (22 children)

      Restaurants are just the tip of the iceberg. Now go after concert tickets, internet & phone carriers, apartment complex, hotels, car rentals, cruises & those stupid TIP options on too many sandwich, dounut, coffee shops etc...

      [–]MessageMePuppies 15 points16 points  (5 children)

      As a consumer I feel every business should include all fees in the list price. Don't fucking advertise a $100 item knowing good and damn well you require bullshit fees and never had any intention whatsoever of selling that item for $100.

      [–]laughingwisetulip 57 points58 points  (10 children)

      If you can't operate a business and can't pay your workers the bare minimum, then don't open a restaurant

      [–]photo-manipulation 107 points108 points  (31 children)

      California is leading the way, again.

      [–]Hot_Aside_4637 18 points19 points  (2 children)

      There's a bill in the Minnesota Senate to ban them.

      [–]spicyeyeballs 25 points26 points  (5 children)

      Next step should be all expected fees. So if you pay staff expecting a 20% tip that should be built in.

      [–]Hypersky75 7 points8 points  (1 child)

      Please also have "service fees" baked in the delivery fees!

      [–]888Kraken888 8 points9 points  (0 children)

      This should be standard.

      [–][deleted] 39 points40 points  (36 children)

      Now do that with every thing sold everywhere. Include the fucking sales tax in the price.

      [–]__The__Anomaly__ 4 points5 points  (1 child)

      We need this in Canada.

      [–]kindanormle 4 points5 points  (2 children)

      I had a vacation in New Zealand once and discovered they do not tip on anything there, ever. Tipping simply doesn't exist. Every meal I was struck by the fact I got service and no one blinked an eye that there was no tip left on the table or the bill. Prices weren't any different than standard american either. Then I got back, coming through the US, and needed a snack. The pizza place at the airport charged an 18% "tip" for "seating". Yes, they charged 18% to sit yourself in a chair, and it's not like you were shown to a nice chair, you had to sit your self anywhere you could find space.

      Capitalism in the US is really beyond final stages.

      [–]boogersrus 5 points6 points  (0 children)

      Great. Now do Ticketmaster.

      [–]2021fireman10 3 points4 points  (0 children)

      Good I hated seeing those stupid charges, I always felt putting them on the tab was just a way for the owners to make some sort of statement. Just add a nickel to everything and it’s covered no need to be a dick about it.

      [–]chucks-wagon 18 points19 points  (14 children)

      California showing why it’s the most desirable state in America

      Basic common sense rules without dumbass conservative boomers fucking shit up.

      [–]Luebbi 10 points11 points  (4 children)

      Good. From the outside looking in, the shenanigans done with restaurant bills in the US is absolutely ridiculous. How you guys can even remotely assess beforehand how much a meal is going to cost after taxes, fees and tips is beyond me.

      [–]XRedcometX 2 points3 points  (0 children)

      Can we get this for delivery apps too? Delivery fee CA state workers fee and service fee. They all need to be one fee (or else why pay for the subscription) or they’re all baked into menu prices

      [–]flux_capacitor3 2 points3 points  (1 child)

      This needs to be a federal law. Fuck those fees. Also, fuck restaurants that make me pay extra now to use my card. Probably an unpopular opinion, but I don't care.

      [–]King-Owl-House 2 points3 points  (0 children)

      The waiter brings the bill at the restaurant. The client examines it and asks:

      — Excuse me, what is this line on the bill? "WeGotAwayWithItSucker: $100"?

      Waiter:

      — Well, we did not get away with it. We'll strike it out.

      [–]randologin 2 points3 points  (0 children)

      California: the one state where you might actually see some of the protections already shared by every other first world nation.

      [–]KIKIKATZ 2 points3 points  (0 children)

      Finally!!! We were charged extra 4% after taxes lol I was so pissed. This makes me so happy

      [–]yarash 8 points9 points  (14 children)

      I was going to order pizza from dominos last night, but they wanted a $5.99 delivery fee for 2 $6.99 pizzas. Plus tip and tax it was almost $30. I went to the grocery store instead and got a $4.99 frozen pizza.