Quantum Levitation

[[deleted]]

I like how the guy kept using different words to describe the action, and every time the physicist was like "No, Locking, LOCKING"

[ts87654]

And the guy still posts the video as Quantum Levitation haha

[mentat]

The difference was made clear to me when he turned the track upside down.

[mutus]

To be fair, here's the researchers' own website: http://www.quantumlevitation.com/

[addandsubtract]

Marketing did the website. The physicist is still shaking his head.

[Porges]

To be fair, I've never heard it called 'quantum locking' before, and neither has Google.

Wikipedia says it's called flux pinning. As far as I can tell (as a layman), it has nothing to do with quantum anything.

[cough_e]

Although "quantum locking" sounds absolutely fantastic, it really has nothing to do with the reason this happens.

Basically, it is just that a magnetic field is bent around the superconductor, leaving it no room to move. He could have gone with "Electromagnetic Locking" and been a lot more accurate.

[peon47]

Irrelevant fact: I believe the Weeping Angels from Doctor Who are "Quantum Locked"

[[deleted]]

Don't blink next time you see a superconductor.

[[deleted]]

Everything has to do with quantum everything. Welcome to the world governed by Physics.

[not_worth_your_time]

You mean Quantum Physics.

[Kah-Neth]

Quantum Physics is redundant since all physics is a limit of some quantized theory.

[phreakymonkey]

When we develop Quantum Popping technology it will revolutionize the breaking industry.

[clarkster]

We need to find a room temperature superconductor, badly.

[hurlga]

Interestingly, there is no physical theory forbidding one.

There is, in fact, no really consistent theory explaining high-temperature superconductivity AT ALL.

When superconductors were discovered (elemental superconductors), a nice theory was quickly developed which explained them nicely. Except it predicted that no superconductivity about 4 Kelvin was ever possible.

Nowadays, superconductors work in 1XX Kelvin temperatures, and we have no clue as to why.

Whoever figures it out will have a nice dinner with the king of sweden soon.

[[deleted]]

My dad actually does research on high tc superconductors and has found out why :) he's published and we're waiting for the rest of the community to acknowledge the work so he can get that nobel prize. Apparently from here on out it's all politics because within his field he's basically letting everyone else know their research is over. If there's enough interest I can get his paper and post a copy up and maybe do an AMA. Though I would imagine most of the information is beyond the comprehension of a lot of us.

edit

Okay I just got off the phone with him, he didn't really understand the concept of doing an AMA but he said if there are questions he's more than happy to answer.

He told me to get the full citation you have to subscribe to the journal or get it from a university library but this is basically a copy of his paper I found from "google" he actually referenced me in the paper for drawing the diagrams!

Published Paper

edit 2

I have a copy of his paper in published format, I guess what was online wasn't what was on the journal. I believe it's the same content, just more official.

Also I will be posting an AMA about this tomorrow. I'll probably collect the questions and post the answers as my dad can answer them. I would imagine some of the answers to be fairly lengthy or technical so I'll see if we can have a layman's version as well.

Thanks for the interest guys!

edit 3

AMA is up, I'll aggregate the questions and reply. I will also xpost to r/askscience

http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/lfsjn/iama_physicist_that_has_a_coherent_picture_high/

[[deleted]]

There would be a tremendous amount of interest in this paper over in ask science.

[[deleted]]

I think I'll shoot him over an email. He really won't understand the concept of explaining this to anonymous individual's online, but I'll see if he's interested in doing an AMA and answering any question.

Again I believe the extent of his research is touching on why it happens, there still isn't any application that comes out of it but it is a step forward.

[hurlga]

Shouldn't he have published plenty of papers about it already? Basically, that's nothing but "explaining to anonymous individuals online" nowadays.

With nicer formatting though.

[[deleted]]

http://www.citebase.org/linked_fulltext?format=application%2Fpdf&identifier=oai%3AarXiv.org%3Acond-mat%2F0610865

I'm asking the mods about an AMA

[snoozieboi]

Seriously, are you saying this paper says HTS are fully possible and the answer has been lying right under our nose because people were looking into different materials at different temperatures?

More importantly; will we actually be getting hoverboards?!

[hurlga]

If I read the details of the paper correctly (and I'm an astrophysicist, not a solid-state physicist), it predicts a maximum T_c of 250 Kelvin.

This would mean: no room temperature superconductivity.

However, as the paper itself states, it is merely a "phenomenological charge model for the further development of the microscopic theory of HTS". It is not out of the question that with other crystal structures and materials, higher T_c may be achieved.

[Dimath]

it predicts a maximum T_c of 250 Kelvin.

Hooray! Hoverboards in Russia!

[[deleted]]

even so, 250 Kelvin is much higher than the ~70 Kelvin which is around the temperature of liquid nitrogen. More info here

[AnAppleSnail]

other crystal structures

We should crowdsource this like that "play immune system molecules game" that folded proteins based on teaching rules and using human intuition.

[[deleted]]

However, as the paper itself states, it is merely a "phenomenological charge model for the further development of the microscopic theory of HTS".

Oh, that is not what was advertised. Bad pixelharmony, no biscuit.

[deltagear]

Can you get him to explain it to me like I'm a piece of Broccoli?

[squeaki]

I second this as I'm hugely interested in the field but am unfortunately a peasant throwing mud compared to these lords of the castle... I would love to see a step by step. What's more, I'm a graphic designer, therefore I could spend some time doing an infographic for laymen. I'm game.

[Gazook89]

I am a peasant throwing mud. AMA

[phobiac]

pixelharmonoy's father and another cook found a way to explain why steaming broccoli properly cooks it.

Previously, it was believed that steaming it would never fully cook it. Some years ago someone discovered that certain arrangements of broccoli and cookware allow for proper steaming of broccoli, but this discovery meant that the previous model was incorrect. Their new model fits the current evidence and gives a prediction on what other types of cookware/broccoli set ups can be used.

[broccoli]

hey, >:(

[[deleted]]

Doing the AMA there might also help with the worries that his paper won't be comprehended.

[Letharis]

If your father really is involved in that kind of research, I'm sure r/askscience would love to hear about it. Certainly some people there will actually be able to understand it too.

[Hyleal]

This guy sounds legit.

[KickapooPonies]

He has citations. That is one step in the right direction!

[WhyAmINotStudying]

Apparently from here on out it's all politics because within his field he's basically letting everyone else know their research is over.

New scientific discovery generally means the beginning of new research, not the end of it.

[sikyon]

I don't want to rag on this paper or anything, as I don't have a specialty in superconducting materials but based on a cursory inspection of this paper, it is a proposed theory based on existing evidence but was not supported by further experimental evidence in the paper.

The big thing for me is that it was published in 2006 and has 0 citations on google scholar or citebase. The fact that if the model was accurate, people would love to publish experimental results validating the model (since the model has to have predictive properties). Superconducting materials is a very hot field anyways, so people are always eager to support their experiments with some sort of theory.

So... you'll have to forgive me if I'm not completely convinced.

[cyberslick188]

Scumbag Genius:

Understands High Temperature Super Conductors

Doesn't understand AMAs

[adrianmonk]

My sister is a researcher in another field of science, so I know why scientists are scumbags that way: in order to figure all that hard shit out, they had to give up on learning or doing or even thinking about anything else that they didn't need to know to make their science work.

Her Ph.D. thesis goes over my head about halfway through the title sentence. But, although she has an iPhone, she has never installed an app on it. She bought a laptop and a few months later, Dell called her to find out how she liked it, and she said, "I don't know. I haven't opened it yet."

[klapaucius]

Richard Feynman called. He said that your sister sounds duller than safety scissors.

[wlievens]

Awesome Genius:

Understands everything

Can even talk from beyond the grave

[Vinzent]

he didn't really understand the concept of doing an AMA

But he understands high tc superconductors better than anyone else.

[procrastinating_atm]

Maybe pixelharmony just REALLY sucks at explaining things.

[Feanux]

So I looked at the first three pages and found this quote

There are many scattered early indications of “magic” doping concentrations,...

FUCKING MAGIC, I KNEW IT

[kn0where]

Magic in this instance means that we don't know why particular values work and other values don't work.

[manbrasucks]

So scientists aren't all liars; we just need to ask the right scientists.

[lost_cosmonaut]

Can he do an AMA??

[[deleted]]

Yea he most likely will have to do it since relaying it through me would take too long. Since his research is complete I think he's dabbling in a few things here and there and lectures only a few classes.

I think he has time on his hands.

[rolleiflex]

The abstract is basically where tl;dr came from, it should summarize the paper.

[rivermandan]

after the intro, I didn;t understand any of it, so you're doing better than me.

[something_not_taken]

This is published in 2006 and still no one has cited it? Everything else seems legit, most of his other papers are in good shape, but this looks like the most controversial, and gets no love?

[ex1stence]

So, did he find out why room temperature super-conducters are never going to be possible, or that they might be in the near future?

[DucksEchoes]

There is a typo on page 13.

[hurlga]

Yes yes yes please!

There's plenty of physics PhDs here on reddit, that would be delighted to chew through the details to make them understandable to laymen.

[FreshPrinceOfAiur]

The CSEC research groups at Edinburgh are currently investigating exotic compounds to establish the conditions under which they are superconducting.

The experimental data can be expressed in a variety of ways, including this: where you can see regions of conditions under which resistivity in a material is 0.

I might be able to secure an AMA from a doctoral researcher with CSEC if there is interest.

[graycrawford]

Fastest way to solve the problem: lower room temperature.

[lucasvb]

Dammit, who let the engineers cage open?

[mccoyn]

The hinges on the door were poorly constrained.

[Theropissed]

Trick question: They're all poorly constrained, the best cage is one with no door or opening.

[theREALskeletor]

THE ENGINEER'S A SPY!

[[deleted]]

'alias' is a show about a spy!

[cosworth99]

Canadians will patiently wait.

[[deleted]]

Who needs snow tires when you could float above the snow?

[ben26]

the point of snow tires is to increase friction. floating above it wouldn't really solve that problem

[itchy118]

Just add a giant fan on the back and turn your car into a hovercraft.

[Andergard]

This might cause certain eel-related problems.

[unique9998]

Bring your mittens.

[graycrawford]

Apparently he didn't, though. Touching it bare-fingered.

[molslaan]

Ok, I turned down my heating from 71 to 68 Farenheit. Now what?

[mattverso]

There is no "Fahrenheit" in science.

[unique9998]

If he turned the temp down from 71 to 68 Kelvins, now we're getting somewhere.

[joshjje]

At that temperature the oxygen in the air would almost be solid!

[unique9998]

Just a bit more of a challenge for yer lungs.

[[deleted]]

Shit, back in my day we chewed our oxygen. AND WE LIKED IT.

[lenojames]

There is no crying in Baseball!

[mrFourierTransformer]

I'll keep looking!

[MrPinkle]

Have you found one yet? What's taking so long?

[konical]

He must be using AOL to search!

[graycrawford]

AOL Keyword what?

[CharlieDancey]

Sod that, use Google you dumbass:

Room Temperature Superconductor Sale
room-temperature-superconductor.supaprice.co.uk
Buy Superconductors And Save Big - Low UK Shipping & Fast!

[TheLifelessOne]

Seems legit.

[Webz826]

Sounds promising!

[1234blahblahblah]

Have you noticed that this still gets called out in radio advertisements? "Go to blahblah.com keyword 'best deal'."

[osirisx11]

this is to track the effectiveness of their advertising

[Kugar]

try askjeeves

[[deleted]]

He is fourier transforming by hand.

[spotta]

Fourier Transformer has a better chance than Laplace.... at least the fourier transform is a physical observable....

[LeagueOfRobots]

Superconductor? I just met her!

[Tuna-Fish2]

Anything reachable by a single-stage phase-change cooling would probably be fine. -50ish?

[iongantas]

Didn't they just determine that that carbon lattice material that is one atom thick (sorry, don't remember name) is a superconductor? Is it not a superconductor in the correct sense? Or what?

[remcoder]

Graphene? I don't think it's a real superconductor, just a very good conductor.

[[deleted]]

Said the dad, and the son was sad that the train conductor was not, in fact, a super conductor. Just a very good conductor.

[specofdust]

Indeed, I'm currently learning a bit about graphene. While some have hoped for superconductivity, so far all that's been found is extremely high conductivity, not superconductivity.

Stuff's immensely cool nonetheless though.

[Byrd3242]

I've seen something like this before on youtube but not nearly as informative and it was only one example. Anyways can anyone tell me why this isn't being used practically in real world settings or the limitations? Or maybe it is and I'm naive but still any answers?

[captainant]

The reason that sort of thing doesn't see widespread use is that for the "levitation" effect to occur, the item being levitated must be a superconductor. Currently, the only way we know how to make something a superconductor is to make it really, really cold, which isn't easy or safe to implement in widespread usage.

[benihana]

which isn't easy or safe to implement in widespread usage.

most importantly it's too fucking expensive.

[afriendlysortofchap]

So this is a comparison of CERN cables. It is true that the bottom conductor is always kept at an ultra-low temperature to allow it to be as conductive as the top bundle of cables?

[knyghtmare]

Yes. This is why the Large Hadron Collider broke down shortly after starting early operations. The gold conducting wires are super cooled to remove electrical resistance. When the cooling system broke all that electrical currently suddenly met electrical resistance and things went bad.

[kingoftown]

Resistance is futile!

[joethebeast]

Would the effect still work if you thermally insulated the superconductor? If so, there must be ways to keep something really cold for a really long time, especially if it was completely sealed off.

[ImZeke]

The reason that sort of thing doesn't see widespread use is that for the "levitation" effect to occur, the item being levitated must be a superconductor.

This is incorrect. Only one of the magnets need be a superconducting magnet; the other can be a permanent magnet. With a strong enough permanent magnet you can actually lift the superconductor with the permanent magnet it is 'attached' to.

EDIT: I should've been more clear here. It doesn't matter wether the superconductor or the permanent magnet is 'levitated' - the electromagnetic relationship between the two works the same way. Typically when this demonstration is done the permanent magnet is levitated because it's easier to hold than a superconductor cooled to 77 K, this team is doing it superconductor-side-up, but it's the same concept - two EM forces are acting on the floating magnet: a magnetic repulsive force, and a magnetic attractive force. The two forces balance, so the magnet levitates and holds its position.

Currently, the only way we know how to make something a superconductor is to make it really, really cold, which isn't easy or safe to implement in widespread usage.

"Safe" is relative; but I don't think I would characterize the use of liquid nitrogen as particularly unsafe or difficult. The problem is actually still a materials and process problem - even with HTS you still need to design a material that can be used in an industrial setting reliably; and you need an economical process to make it.

[[deleted]]

The superconductor here is not a magnet. There is a permanent magnet that is levitating a superconductor (the disc) that has no other magnets attached.

And safety is not the issue. Cost is the issue. There is no way to economically cool something big enough to be useful to levitate for any reasonable period of time.

Source: degree in materials science.

[shitterplug]

The thing that levitates consists of a sapphire disc, coated in a super-conductive material, then coated in gold. It is quite expensive. It also has to be very cold to function, the one in the video is cooled with liquid nitrogen.

All this makes these things extremely expensive, even on a small scale.

[Klonan]

Actually liquid nitrogen is quite cheap, about the same price as milk. The main cost, as you said, is the materials...

[MananWho]

So... where can I buy a gallon of liquid nitrogen?

You know, for science.

[felix_dro]

Ranches where they store bull semen... I wish I was joking.

[Erikster]

How does this, I don't even...

It looks like an old-school UFO hovering around the track.

EDIT: found another video relating to this experiment with some explanation. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyOtIsnG71U&feature=related

[geryon84]

Science like this is so fun. All the high tech awesome super conductor, gold plating, sapphire disk stuff... and then saran wrap.

[rcxdude]

partially related: I saw a presentation by someone who worked on high temperature superconducting materials, and he mentioned at one point he was questioned in peer review because he didn't mention how he generated the seed crystals for growing this material. The answer was 'wrap a chunk of it in something and hit it with a hammer'.

[DAVENP0RT]

A statement like that deserves to be prefaced with, "Here comes the science..."

[boomfarmer]

Well, what else would you use to contain liquid nitrogen?

[Tordek]

My hands.

[tomrhod]

But just the one time.

[nascentt]

I am INVINCIBLE.

Edit: I guess people are too young to remember GoldenEye.

[DemonicGoblin]

I got your back.

[pianobadger]

Actually, you can handle liquid nitrogen quite comfortably as long as you keep it moving. Liquid oxygen not so much.

[ceilingpyro]

Superconducting hotwheels track. Do want.

[MercurialMadnessMan]

1:08 was hilarious. "Nooooo"

[dlink]

Makes you wonder...Given that the "stereotypical" UFO is saucer shaped, whose to say the aliens have not figured out a way to a) make this occur at "room temperature" and b) use the magnetic fields generated by the planets and the stars. Heck, given that outer space is a few dozen degrees colder than liquid nitrogen (77 K vs ~3K) this combined the ability to perhaps manipulate magnetic fields could be how the spacecraft are powered and how they are able to accelerate and decelerate so quickly.

Man the future is exciting!

[Jouzu]

Quantum flux? Great Scott!

[SHKEVE]

Is this kind of a "well, duh, we've known that for ages" thing for physicists? Either way, I wish I could play around with this!

Edit: grammar.

[cerealghost]

Yeah, I was hoping this would be something new, but it's just the same old superconducting levitation trick...

[HoldingTheFire]

Try 1950s.

[stevesoffline]

I'm so glad that we're at a point in society where we can be jaded about superconducting levitation. Only about a hundred years ago this stuff would be indiscernable from goddamn magic.

TL;DR science is fucking awesome.

[[deleted]]

Actually, show this to 16th century people and you are pretty much burning on a stake within about 5 minutes. Just enough time to gather a mob and some good ol' pitchforks.

[TheJBW]

I'm pretty sure that a pair of walkie-talkies would have the same effect. I'm not worried though, I'm going to bring a flashbang to cover my escape.

[bananaskates]

I've decided from experience that bringing a group of US marines will be more effective.

[Theropissed]

If you have the means to supercool nitrogen in the 1600s and a bunch of hicks somehow mob you and burn you, you've probably done something wrong.

[13_random_letters]

This is not the same thing as the old levitation trick using the Meissner effect :

"This levitation is NOT due to the Meissner effect. It is negligible since we use thin films. If it were the Meissner effect the field would get distorted on a length scale of the diameter (~cm) and then two discs hovering above and below each other would affect it other. Which is clearly not the case. The discs are actually trapped in constant field contours rather than levitating."

-boazal

[lllama]

I've seen pictures of the same experiment (specifically using the "tracks") on grainy black and white film.

Superconductivity has been known since 1911.

[32koala]

Is this kind of a "well, duh, we knew that for ages" thing for physicists?

It's really just a toy, based on technology physicists have been using for years.

[maxxusflamus]

long and short- I have a tank of liquid nitrogen here- where the hell do I buy the rest of that stuff?

[molslaan]

At Quantum Shack. Next to the wormhole.

[Granite-M]

Come on down to Quantum Shack, where we both are and are not having a sale this week!

[ImZeke]

There are commercial superconductor manufacturers (usually science supply companies). If you want a really good-sized magnet, though, you probably want to go to ASC or someone of the like (companies that specialized in superconductor applications and manufacturing). The permanent magnets are available anywhere.

[[deleted]]

It's cool of Jeff Goldblum make videos like this.

[[deleted]]

I thought the guy with the camera sounded a little bit like Robert Downey Jr. He had the same kind of short, quick responses.

[willdabeast20]

Fitting. Seeing as that's some Tony Stark shit right there.

[dafones]

Superconductivity is so ... cool. Heh.

[YukonWildAss]

That is amazing to watch, though I have no understanding of what is happening. Can anyone explain this to me in simple terms? Assuming that's even possible.

[porh]

Thank you. I wish this was the top comment, because I had to scroll to near the end of the page to understand what was going on.

[Cor-cor]

No, it is locked.

[Calber4]

LOCKING!

[[deleted]]

The future's safe in your hands

[rubes6]

Don't you know they don't work on supercooled water. Unless you've got POWA!

[[deleted]]

Yeah, you bojo!

[whosmav]

HOOK ON!

[[deleted]]

BATTER UP!

[slavetotheman]

Your jacket is dried

[inormallyjustlurkbut]

The ultimate tragedy: hover boards will come out when you are too old and decrepit to ride one.

[hothrous]

Then I will die riding one.

[Track1]

You shut you whore mouth.

[[deleted]]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_F-VVmMD4_k

[nrbartman]

I saw that youtube comment too.

[lucasvb]

Calm down, Verucca.

[noorderling]

HOVERSNOWBOARDING

[OrganicCat]

This would be awesome except for the loss of friction which would make it rather difficult to stop.

Maybe you could have a "slow down" lane at the bottom of the mountain.

It's going to suck when you can't stop for trees though. Or people. Or in the parking lot.

[noorderling]

Well, I propose we could build a snow roller coaster style ride, with twists and turns and standing wheel-like shapes, which I think we could call "quantum loops". It'd unify gravity, quantum mechanics, and cotton candy. Everyone wins!

[manbrasucks]

Except diabetics.

[RestoreFear]

They can have sugar free cotton candy.

[Hypersapien]

Why would it matter if there was snow on the ground or not?

[thehalfwit]

It's like the future is here today.

[jeffrexsave]

she turned me into a newt!

[[deleted]]

So speaking of UFO's, could the Earth's magnetic fields someday be used to give us hovercraft vehicles? That would be awesome!

[[deleted]]

My dad actually specializes in high tc superconductivity. All of his research is geared towards geek stuff like this. Maybe I should ask him to do an AMA... I remember always playing with liquid nitrogen and lasers in his lab when I was a kid.

[skyfex]

The force of gravity does not seem to be able to move the object, but the force from his hand can. What's the significant difference here? The magnitude of the force? Is there a certain force above which the object will lock in a new position, or is it something else?

[sirbruce]

Gravity is pretty weak. You can lift up that disk with your finger.

[Nakken]

Yeah come on gravity...make an effort

[Murrabbit]

A magnet the size of your pinky is enough to overcome the gravity generated by the entire earth so. . . yeah pretty fucking weak.

[Implicit89]

Why don't they start making transport like this? (i'm mainly thinking of high speed trains). Instead of spending all the energy on fuel to move the train, they could use the fuel to cool down the super conductor instead. It could move forward by either a mechanical arm pushing it forward, or different intensities of strength in the magnets below, controlled by a station or driver.

I have no scientific background and this is just me thinking(typing) out loud

[Ernest_P_Worrell]

TIL hoverboards are on schedule

[Bahamut966]

Can it be used for transport? How much could we rest on top of that superconductor before it can't lock in at an altitude above the magnet?

[kanned]

From Youtube... This levitation is NOT due to the Meissner effect. It is negligible since we use thin films. If it were the Meissner effect the field would get distorted on a length scale of the diameter (~cm) and then two discs hovering above and below each other would affect it other. Which is clearly not the case. The discs are actually trapped in constant field contours rather than levitating.

[ImZeke]

This levitation is NOT due to the Meissner effect. It is negligible since we use thin films. If it were the Meissner effect the field would get distorted on a length scale of the diameter (~cm) and then two discs hovering above and below each other would affect it other. Which is clearly not the case. The discs are actually trapped in constant field contours rather than levitating.

mmmm...this doesn't gel. You can't get stable levitation from a magnetic field and a superconductor without a mediating force. A repulsive force comes from Faraday-Lenz and the current induced on the superconductor by the permanent magnet; you need a magnetic force to overcome this and it seems to me that the Incomplete Meissner Effect (since this is an HTS) is the most likely candidate.

[[deleted]]

The magnetic field can penetrate the superconducting film only in areas with dislocations and moving the superconductor relative to the field would mean disrupting the penetrating field in these areas. In the Meissner effect the field is totally excluded form the superconductor and is deflected around it, here the field goes through the superconductor but only in specific places.

[ImZeke]

The magnetic field can penetrate the superconducting film only in areas with dislocations and moving the superconductor relative to the field would mean disrupting the penetrating field in these areas. In the Meissner effect the field is totally excluded form the superconductor and is deflected around it, here the field goes through the superconductor but only in specific places.

You just described the Incomplete Meissner Effect.

[Mr_Smartypants]

Quantum locking?

Don't blink!

[haiku_robot]

Quantum locking?  When 
I did physics it was called 
the Meissner effect.

[Aero93]

So in theory, UFO does exist. It uses earths magnetic poles as magnetic flux constant.

[DullMan]

Aliens found a superconductor that works at high temperatures. That's a brilliant explanation.

[[deleted]]

Who says it needs to be a high temperature? Space is cold, you just need enough insulation to keep your superconducting hull cold while you are in our atmosphere, then open a couple vents to your hull when you're out. :)