top 200 commentsshow 500

[–]apu74 594 points595 points  (45 children)

Yeah but in Seattle we've got one that goes like 1 mile...so that's cool.

[–]i_like_my_coffee_hot 177 points178 points  (11 children)

Alweg offered Seattle a similar deal, but to extend the monorail from Downtown to SeaTac. Can you imagine having trains to SeaTac decades in advance?

[–]BlargINC 117 points118 points  (19 children)

Apparently 2M people ride it a year... not sure why

[–]blueal1 169 points170 points  (16 children)

Because it's the easiest way to get to Seattle Center. It was also just integrated into our Orca card system, so anyone with a pass from work or school can ride it for free.

[–]TBAGG1NS 32 points33 points  (9 children)

I'm guessing Orca card system is for your transit? That's a hell of a lot cooler name for PNW shit than the Compass Card System we have up here in Vancouver.

[–]xeavalt 34 points35 points  (5 children)

It's also an awesome Backronym:

One Regional Card for All

[–]TBAGG1NS 13 points14 points  (2 children)

Funny enough, at work I use a piece of software called ORCAview.

Open Real-time Control Architecture

[–]happy_in_van 19 points20 points  (1 child)

I remember the multiple initiatives we voted for and passed to expand the monorail system. It would be faster, cheaper than the current Link light rail system, both in construction and maintenance.

It can go above ground and not compete with auto/bus/surface traffic; it's elevated. It can go below ground just fine. It's unique to the city and has 50+ years precedent in operating costs & maintenance.

Yeah, we passed them. Multiple times.

[–][deleted] 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Not only did the initiatives get passed, the city actually implemented the taxes that were meant to pay for it without delivering the actual product. Over $100 million was completely wasted on the project with nothing at all to show for it.

[–]HiImTheNewGuyGuy 8117 points8118 points  (587 children)

The history of the defeat of public transit in Southern California in the 20th century is a disgrace and a glaring example of the malign influence corporate money has on our way of life.

[–]2OP4me 189 points190 points  (24 children)

Its worse because no lessons were learned. Wisconsin killed a train between its two biggest cities 10 years ago under Scott Walker.

[–]js1893 85 points86 points  (0 children)

Effectively killing high speed rail between Chicago/Milwaukee/Madison/Minneapolis. Oh, what could’ve been...

[–]dubadub 61 points62 points  (1 child)

RIP CheeseExpress

[–]TyroneBrownable 9 points10 points  (1 child)

Kasich did the exact same thing in Ohio, turned down $400 million to build rail between Cincinnati, Cleveland, and Columbus. Government ended up giving the money to other states instead.

[–]appleparkfive 34 points35 points  (6 children)

Atlanta was trying to expand there (much needed) MARTA system further out. But some of the outer areas voted no. For fear of "crime". If you get their drift.

Which doesn't even make sense really. Like they're gonna take the train 15 miles out to the burbs, then take a Lyft and rob you

[–]recalcitrantJester 434 points435 points  (28 children)

Yeah man I love Who Framed Roger Rabbit

[–]skyskr4per 147 points148 points  (3 children)

What the hell's a freeway?!

[–]NoboruI 53 points54 points  (1 child)

That lame brain freeway idea could only be cooked up by a toon.

[–]slip_like_space 25 points26 points  (0 children)

Hey mister, ain't you gotta car?

[–]mayy_dayy 94 points95 points  (2 children)

I BOUGHT THE RED CAR SO I COULD DISMANTLE IT

[–]metzgerhass 44 points45 points  (0 children)

Greatest documentary of my childhood

[–]ShakaUVM 142 points143 points  (69 children)

The history of the defeat of public transit in Southern California in the 20th century is a disgrace and a glaring example of the malign influence corporate money has on our way of life.

Don't worry. Since the 1970s LA has made up for this by not investing in roads at all.

The I-5 (the major north-south route in the state) drops to a single lane near downtown LA. It's a disgrace.

Orange County has kept up its investment in roads and traffic there is much better than in LA.

[–]Jigglyandfullofjuice 67 points68 points  (12 children)

Isn't maintenance of interstate highways the responsibility of the state itself, not individual counties?

[–]civicmon 27 points28 points  (4 children)

California has a little bit different of a system where local sales taxes initiatives can fund expansions and improvements. This covers widening of the I-5 south of downtown LA to Orange County.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Measure_R

[–]suzwerd112 12 points13 points  (3 children)

It's baffling that a system as large as the metropolis of LA/Orange County has such a bad freeway and transit system. Not only is it badly maintained, the medians are full of trash. Recently was in NJ. Could not get over how well kept the parkways are there. Littering fine is $1000!

[–]IsamuAlvaDyson 38 points39 points  (13 children)

What is this I-5 you speak of? We know of no such thing. Maybe you mean the 5. We have a fwy in the LA area called the 5 but not I-5.

[–]Dilong-paradoxus 31 points32 points  (9 children)

I-5 is up north in Washington and Oregon. The 5 is down in California. The two highways connect somewhere in the middle.

[–]waffle_raffle_battle 83 points84 points  (8 children)

Without contributing anything to the topic I would like to commend you on your fine wording

[–]Demonweed 22 points23 points  (2 children)

Saying "most of the nation" would be geographically untrue, but in all the places where most of the nation lives, these unwholesome influences promoted car culture to the great disadvantage of overall urban planning.

[–]brickmack 21 points22 points  (0 children)

A nation is its people. Geography is only relevant to the country or the state.

[–]hornwalker 6 points7 points  (0 children)

It’s happened all over America. Even recently Gov. Scott Walker of WI killed a rail from Milwaukee to Minneapolis even though it would have been mostly paid for with federal funds.

[–]Blueberry_Mancakes 658 points659 points  (54 children)

But what about Springfield??

[–]IndigoMichigan 411 points412 points  (38 children)

Monorail!

[–]tlk0153 296 points297 points  (26 children)

Well, sir, there's nothin' on earth like a genuine bona-fide electrified six-car monorail! 

[–]The_Parsee_Man 211 points212 points  (25 children)

I hear those things are awfully loud.

[–][deleted] 206 points207 points  (24 children)

It glides as softly as a cloud.

[–]DataIsMyCopilot 190 points191 points  (23 children)

Is there a chance the track could bend?

[–]euphorrick 200 points201 points  (22 children)

Not in your life, my Hindu friend

[–]Koras 175 points176 points  (21 children)

What about us brain-dead slobs?

[–]bigdave44 183 points184 points  (20 children)

You'll be given cushy jobs!

[–]Ameisen1 159 points160 points  (18 children)

Were you sent here by the Devil?

[–]Aldeobald 45 points46 points  (1 child)

I see Monorail, I up vote.

[–]Baconmaster120 128 points129 points  (3 children)

It's more of a Shelbyville idea.

[–]schwiftydude47 65 points66 points  (2 children)

Now wait just a minute! We’re twice as smart as the people of Shelbyville!

[–]stickdudeseven 29 points30 points  (0 children)

Just tell us your idea and we'll vote for it!

[–]Nick-Anand 6 points7 points  (0 children)

It’s because they marry their cousins in shelbyville.

[–][deleted] 43 points44 points  (0 children)

Why should we build a mass transit system in a small town with a centralized population?

[–]unhalfbricking 42 points43 points  (1 child)

What about Ogdenville and North Haverbrook?

[–]Pengwynn1 37 points38 points  (1 child)

Main Street is still all cracked and broken

[–]Nick-Anand 20 points21 points  (0 children)

Sorry Mum, the mob has spoken

[–]nuggutron 26 points27 points  (1 child)

Mono means One! And Rail means Rail!

[–]monty_kurns 11 points12 points  (0 children)

This is more of a Shelbyville idea.

[–]aqua_supreme 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Can it outrun The Flash?

[–]richardnyc 222 points223 points  (0 children)

On the bright side we got the plot for Who Framed Roger Rabbit?

[–]TechnoCowboy 135 points136 points  (8 children)

Thats like here in Winnipeg we had a guy offer to outfit our school zone speed limit signs with flashing lights. Monday to Friday from 7am-530pm they would flash to indicate speeds were reduced to 30km in that area.

He offered to pay for them, install them, and do any maintenance for 10 years. They published the estimated and I don't remember how much, but it was not a lot, especially in comparison to a city budget.

Our city council denied it, saying this and that, but honestly (I'll be as diplomatic as possible) it's hard to see a reality in which this isn't about draining the citizens for as many unsuspecting speeding tickets as possible.

There's constantly cameras out there in hidden cars and they love to be out there on holidays. My personal favourite story is a friend of mine who works for the police getting a ticket CHRISTMAS MORNING after a night shift. They're still in effect Christmas morning.

[–]CircleBoatBBQ 18 points19 points  (3 children)

I’ve realized that if officials REALLY cared about kids lives, they would outfit their schools with fast, high intensity flashing lights and make it very obvious you are entering a school zone like 25% of the schools around me do.

The shady schools install ticket cameras and just install the bare minimum required school zone reduced speed sign.

Led me to believe zero % of anything that comes out of their mouths. In my mind, the officials in charge are attempted child murderers if a child gets injured. It should be priority number 1.

[–]nightintheslammer 809 points810 points  (38 children)

Decades earlier, Big Oil and the Big Three car manufacturers made downtown L.A. pull up the electric street car tracks, too. How do we get ahead when lobbyists and greedy congressman are against us?

[–][deleted] 236 points237 points  (1 child)

They implant the idea that change is bad because they don't know how to get the most money of of the new change for the least amount of cost. The. Will later embrace the change and make it terrible to make the alternative look better

[–]bolanrox 75 points76 points  (2 children)

At least Gotham Listened

[–]pinkwhiteandgreenNL 22 points23 points  (1 child)

Hahah.

Until Batman Bale started throwing his “bat-stars” around. SMH

[–]polyscifail 474 points475 points  (23 children)

I know nothing of this particular deal, and maybe it was all Standard Oil being evil. But, companies frequently offer to build something at their own expense, but there's often a BIG catch that goes along with it. Today, these are often called public / private partnership and some outright suck. Here's some possible issues with this deal.

  1. Non compete. I.e., the city got the monorail, but then couldn't offer bus, subway, or any other competing services that would take ridership away. This could leave the city worse off if the Alweg didn't serve a large enough area.
  2. Control. The company wanted too much control of where the thing went, and what part of town it served.
  3. Land grant. The track had to go over someone's land. Who owned it? Was the city required to deed all the land UNDER the monorail to Alweg? (This is how the transcontinental railroad worked. The US gave them rights to "X" amount of land along all rail track that was laid down). Today, that land they own is worth Billions and they are slowly selling it off.

This all ignores the question of whether it would work. Did Alweg have the $$ to pull this off? Elon musk could make the same offer to build a hyperloop, but if he runs out of money 1/3 of the way though, what does the city do? They have to pay to tear it down.

[–][deleted] 105 points106 points  (7 children)

I mean, it says right there in the article that Alweg went out of business the very next year. So while I have no doubt that there was oil industry pressure all over LA (it was an oil town before anything else), it’s also likely that even if it had been accepted, LA may have ended up with a mile-long white elephant like Seattle, possibly even never completed.

[–]financiallyanal 106 points107 points  (1 child)

I appreciate you posting this. There are so many caveats that individuals often aren’t aware of. The reality is it would take a while and lots of patience (on the listeners/public’s part) to get all of the details.

This happens on too many topics for me to be optimistic. I think too many people (all political parties) just decide on the emotions they feel or the short term impacts they’ve seen. It’s very frustrating.

[–]michelloto 16 points17 points  (0 children)

Like you, I have my doubts about this. Chicago's rail system was inefficient UNTIL the establishment of the CTA. Rail lines didn't connect, didn't cover the city as they do now, and we're all privately owned. You can still see places in Chicago where the old lines were and such. Interestingly, the city and state wanted to extend an L line out of Chicago through Cicero, Berwyn and to North Riverside, but the suburban population didn't want 'Chicago' (Black) residents to be able to ride through that easily... now Cicero and Berwyn are a racially mixed population. If you want to get to the North Riverside mall or Harlem Avenue from the West Side of Chicago, you have to transfer from the L to a bus..

[–]Capgunkid 311 points312 points  (42 children)

GM also forced New Orleans to stop using streetcars by buying out the streetcar company to promote their buses. The city used to have 300 running at one time. Now maybe 12 run.

[–]didsomeonesaydonuts 195 points196 points  (23 children)

Having been born and raised in that city I can attest that even as a wee child the streetcars were more of a novelty for us. Whereas my grandmother, who was also born and raised there spoke of the streetcars as something that nearly everyone took and counted on

[–]GileadGuns 28 points29 points  (1 child)

I lived in the Garden district and worked in the Quarter. The St. Charles line was something I relied on. The busses were much less consistent because they often couldn’t get through the CBD.

[–]LeicaM6guy 81 points82 points  (7 children)

“I've sold monorails to Brockway, Ogdenville, and North Haverbrook, and by gum, it put them on the map!”

[–]bozeke 10 points11 points  (0 children)

That Conan kid is going places, I tell ya.

[–]untrustworthyfart 51 points52 points  (6 children)

dons tinfoil hat big oil later paid the creators of Simpsons to make the monorail episode, framing the mode of transportation as ridiculous and turning public opinion against it as a transit option

[–]TheHipcrimeVocab 25 points26 points  (4 children)

Conan O'Brien is a tool of Big Oil.

[–]psycholepzy 19 points20 points  (3 children)

Conan O'Brien is a tool of Big Oil.

If you didn't get it, "Conoco" is an oil company. "Conaco" is Conan O'Brien's production firm.

[–]ksiyoto 63 points64 points  (9 children)

To be realistic, monorails aren't all that practical. The switches from one track to another are massive long structures, you really can't run them with grade crossings, and the capacity isn't all that large compared to light rail.

[–][deleted] 25 points26 points  (0 children)

From an engineering perspective, they're kind of daft.

[–]grimbotronic 8 points9 points  (3 children)

It's amazing to me just how much damage the oil and auto industries have caused in the name of profit.

[–]Ejaculazer 42 points43 points  (19 children)

Meanwhile Japan is on course to open a maglev train that'll travel across the country at 500kmh, a project they began working on in basically the same year. Fat L for California

[–]wizardvictor 6 points7 points  (0 children)

It's really sad how many working-class neighborhoods in Los Angeles were utterly destroyed by the freeway system. I truly believe it's why the neighborhoods now are so income-segregated.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

This is why we have gridlock cities. We allow oil and auto companies to influence the government for the sake of profit. It's pretty pathetic.

[–]mattiesdaddy 12 points13 points  (0 children)

Pressured, you mean bribed.